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[KayentaMoenkopi]

so. The stripping a host rules were voted in but the issue of what to do with the beast still needs solved.

I think that the village head/clan head should handle it.

[Eric]

I think the biju Council should recieve the beast as a placeholder. If there is only one challenger, then that challenger automatically gets the beast. if there is more than one challenger, said challengers duke it out battle royale style until there is only one left standing. The Council then awards the beast to said victor. If there is no victor, then the beast continues to remain with the Council until one of the above awarding conditions is met.

[UettoSenju]

I agree with Eric that it should go to council. I'm sure we are all aware of how the passing around the village loophole has been abused in the past.  Oh my two weeks are up I must fight now.... nah, ill go inactive and it still be passed to someone in the village. There for we never lose the beast.

I honestly believe the beast should always go to the next person in line for challenges. And that person should take up all the challengers in that order upon taking the beast. He/she still get a grace but after that they start with the list the last guy had. That being that these people still wish to challenge.

Now the tricky part is who does it go to when there is no challenger. I'm interested to hear some ideas about that. I myself am still trying to think of the most suitable method for such an ordeal. It should go to council but who do they hand it out to.

My first idea was a nation who has no beast as a balance of powers. Being if they wanted it.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

Well the issue of inheriting bijuu challenge lists certainly has come up before. And it is not fair for people to be wasting their lives away for their chance to host...or at least to have their challenge be met.

However, I truly feel that ALL villages and ALL organizations should NOT be penalized for all time due to the issues raised by a few. There have been many who did the job well in the past.

I think our job is to correct issues to make them work better, not just hand out blanket dictates that hinder/punish those who have been doing a good job just because a few people have botched the job.

SO in the event that a host is stripped what if:

• The village/organization head picks a host within 14 days and the new host inherits the challenge list. If no village/organization head exists, due to the stripped host having no affiliation, the beast defaults to the first on the challenger list. If there was no current challenger list at the time of stripping, then the beast is turned over to the council to choose a new host within 14 days.
• In the event of an inactive village/organization head, the second in command or ruling body/council of that group will immediately take charge of the duty keeping to the 14 day limit.
• If the village/organization fails to meet the guidelines of choosing a new host within 14 days, the beast defaults to the first person on the challenger list. If there was no current challenger list at the time of the stripping, then the beast is turned over to the council to choose a new host within 14 days.
• Where a challenge list exists at the time of stripping, the list shall be inherited by the next host in all cases.

and then this section was not struck through on the original vote.

• If no potential host is found, then the council may choose to host a lottery of applicants [meeting in a paid zone and using the random die generators], a tourney, or assign the SL GM staff to conduct a wild bijuu event. However, judging the tourney matches will default to judge rules. Council members may not serve as judges. Additionally, any SL GM staff who are trying to be hosts may not participate in aspects of a wild bijuu hunt. -->Tourney and Wild Bijuu hunts must be concluded in a timely fashion not to exceed 2 months.

Do we need to say that these alternate methods where the council decides on what method to use in choosing the new host should be started within 14 days, as is stated in the proposals I have made?

[Eric]

...

I think our job is to correct issues to make them work better, not just hand out blanket dictates that hinder/punish those who have been doing a good job just because a few people have botched the job.
...

Not giving them to clans/organizations/villages IS correcting the issue. The issue where the beast cycled within the village of near inactives, or worse, the village simply had trouble finding viable candidates.

I understand your ideology that the beasts are the property of the village, but I and some others don't agree with that. The beasts are the communities' at large. The champion won the beast, the champion should be fully responsible for it, not the village.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

Interesting.

While I say that correcting the problem revolves around not permitting a village/organization to go past 14 days and then jerk it out of their control, so as to allow the competent villages/ organizations to continue handling things in an efficient manner....

you say punish everyone so we do not have to deal with just the ones creating the problem.

[Eric]

Interesting.

While I say that correcting the problem revolves around not permitting a village/organization to go past 14 days and then jerk it out of their control, so as to allow the competent villages/ organizations to continue handling things in an efficient manner....

you say punish everyone so we do not have to deal with just the ones creating the problem.

That is interesting, especially when worded that way to make it sound worse than it really is, especially since the villages/organizations do not own the tailed beasts. The community as a whole does, especially at this juncture.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

When was that decided?

The interpretation of words is just as important, more so in fact, than the words themselves Eric. If I can read what you said and take that meaning, that inference away from them, then they didn't state your intentions clearly enough.

To me it looks like that is exactly what you propose, to...not deal with the problem makers individually but to punish all based on those who made the infraction.

[Rusaku]

Eric is right here, the beast does not belong to the village in any way when I look at it. For example, Rusaku and the 7 tails. In no way does konoha have the rights to my beast. I went out of my own accord and won it without any moral support of any kind from them.  I've even had it for a number of months now, probably close to a half a year(?) And not once has konoha wanted to do an rp about the beast that I captured.

So, no. Konoha should not get the beast. It should go to the council, because that at the very least makes sense.

Now I understand that's not how it works in every village, but it sure wouldn't make sense in this particular situation.

[Eric]

When was that decided?

I think the better question is, when was it ever considered village/organization property since the fall of the last Biju Council?

The responsibilities, rewards, and punishments have been very player-player. When the player messes up, he/she gets stripped, not the village. When a biju is fought for it is the player who wins it, not the village. When he/she breaks the rules, it is not the village that takes them to bat over that (hell, occasionally the village was in full cahoots with the violations). It was the community that discussed it, the community that had to put up with the heat and tension, the community that was heavily involved in all things biju (and other rules)

The community in the past discussed strippings, discussed rules, etc. The community, even now, is making up the rules and stuff. The Council is being picked from the community ass a whole, not as representatives from the villages/organizations.

... The interpretation of words is just as important, more so in fact, than the words themselves Eric. If I can read what you said and take that meaning, that inference away from them, then they didn't state your intentions clearly enough.

To me it looks like that is exactly what you propose, to...not deal with the problem makers individually but to punish all based on those who made the infraction.

What you're taking from it is that this is a "punishment" for all clans/villages/organizations, and if you want to take it that way, then you can (much like how a vaccine can be considered a punishment for other people not being able to prevent the spread of disease).

The main goal is not to punish, but to solve a problem before it becomes a problem (again), to nip it in the bud if you will.

Interpretation is not really a huge issue to me at this point in my post, because regardless of whether it's seen as a punishment for everyone, a flower bud nipping measure, or a condom in heated times, the point is, the Council being given the tailed beast from the get-go is much simpler and faster than handing it to the clan/organization.

[Bocchiere]

Yeah I definitely agree with Eric on this

[Raifudo Oppa]

Erick seems to have the better reasoning in this.

Whether or not a host is from a village, there's no need to return the beast to that village. The village didn't win the beast, the player did.

As much as a "punishment" as one may call it, it may in fact just be a liberation of responsibility to have that fall on the village as a whole to elect someone new and have that name be a representation of the village at that point.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

Nipping an issue in the bud, well that is proposed by the 14 day time limit for the village/organization to choose a new host. THEN if they fail that the council steps in...not over top of the village/organization from the beginning...

this ensures that those who do have a good set up be permitted to continue using it.

I am unsure how Konoha's and/or Rusaku's failure to create a bijuu centered rp here has much to do with casting failing over ALL villages and organizations from here on out.

As for Eric making sense, he does certainly make claims about what RULES were agreed upon by ALL of SL at the time he is discussing and presenting here as evidence.

No need to claim a bias, Suna has no Bijuu nor does Kumo or Iwa. But were we to gain one, I certainly wouldn't want our village rights to be jacked by this rule making body based on the failings of other villages and hosts for all time.

What such a rule would do, is keep them from establishing the Bijuu for use in line with Canon roles from Naruto. And that may be an avenue they wish to pursue. By making a rule that excludes the village from having a roll in picking a host, you exclude this story line from ever getting a chance to be implemented and succeed.

I see no reason to prevent the village/organization from having their chance to execute this duty with competence based on the failings of others for all time. And that is what this rule would do.

[Eric]

... What such a rule would do, is keep them from establishing the Bijuu for use in line with Canon roles from Naruto. And that may be an avenue they wish to pursue. By making a rule that excludes the village from having a roll in picking a host, you exclude this story line from ever getting a chance to be implemented and succeed...

In canon, the jinchs were universally tools of war. Suna (to my knowledge and the impression I get from you) is filled with pacifists who's greatest deterrent is "gtfo, we are not RPing a war/battle scenario unless one of our GM's do it cause we're sick of being victims" and not the presence of a tailed beast (argumentatively having one makes you a target, not the other way around) and without GM judges for the entire length of a war, a RP-based SL Great War is most likely a thing of the past. Not to mention Suna isn't exactly flawless in the timely transfer of a tailed beast from one host to the other.

Anyways, have the village keep track of its champion(s) and make sure he/she doesn't get stripped. Simple as that. If there is a serious chance he/she might go inactive stage a mock OOC fight, vote for biju gifting regulations, or something and give the village a chance to have it switch hands to a capable champion before (not that word) the champion gets stripped.

Nipping an issue in the bud, well that is proposed by the 14 day time limit for the village/organization to choose a new host. THEN if they fail that the council steps in...not over top of the village/organization from the beginning...

That "then" statement there is pretty much making the point that you are proposing to allow the plant to grow until it shows its petals/colors; then cut it down if it turns out to be a weed. That is not "nipping it in the bud", that's nipping it "after budding".

[KayentaMoenkopi]

In canon, the jinchs were universally tools of war. Suna (to my knowledge and the impression I get from you) is filled with pacifists who's greatest deterrent is "gtfo, we are not RPing a war/battle scenario unless one of our GM's do it cause we're sick of being victims" and not the presence of a tailed beast (argumentatively having one makes you a target, not the other way around) and without GM judges for the entire length of a war, a RP-based SL Great War is most likely a thing of the past. Not to mention Suna isn't exactly flawless in the timely transfer of a tailed beast from one host to the other.

FRankly Eric after reading this extraneous insult that is off topic to even a broad discussion of how to handle a stripped bijuu, I didn't bother to read the rest.

I would request that in the future you keep your passive aggressive words to yourself and in the event you are unable to convince someone that you are right and all your ideas should be followed to the letter, then you frankly should just let it go rather than resort to making verbal attacks against an entire group of RPers who have not even the ability to respond to such slings and arrows.

Until someone else actually makes a comment concerning the issues, I feel that I have a basic understanding of your concerns upon each point under discussion. I look forward to hearing what the views of other members in this body of rule makers might be.

and yes, I am complaining about your insulting behavior.