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Author Topic: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)  (Read 17667 times)

Gyu~ru~ru

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Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« on: April 28, 2017, 07:21:57 AM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2017, 01:22:31 AM by Gyu~ru~ru »
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Rusaku

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2017, 04:14:52 PM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.


+1
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Hazama

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2017, 05:41:17 PM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.

-1

I know that I'm the most bias party here, but I don't see the point. The more Bijuu a person has, I.E me, then the more difficult it is to defend them all. You know, when people actually go around and challenge someone.
How many Bijuu someone wants should depend on how much of a hassle they are willing to deal with >> Simple as that. Instead of making a rule that says 'Nah, you can't collect', why not just go out and do something about it instead?
« Last Edit: April 28, 2017, 05:47:54 PM by Athos »
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Timothy

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2017, 07:30:09 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.
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Hazama

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2017, 08:27:19 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.
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Vail

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2017, 08:36:48 PM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.


+1

+1
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Vail

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2017, 08:40:07 PM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.

-1

I know that I'm the most bias party here, but I don't see the point. The more Bijuu a person has, I.E me, then the more difficult it is to defend them all. You know, when people actually go around and challenge someone.
How many Bijuu someone wants should depend on how much of a hassle they are willing to deal with >> Simple as that. Instead of making a rule that says 'Nah, you can't collect', why not just go out and do something about it instead?

Because Biju should be used as tools to foster new and interesting roleplays, which is something that SL desperately needs.

We discussed that you were going to distribute the Biju to some of the "lower tier" roleplayers on the site to do just that. Those people can't "go out and do something about it" and likely have no interest when the only people who hold biju are the super competitive world-breaker types.
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Timothy

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2017, 08:54:15 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.

Using myself as an example: I personally haven't challenged you out of consideration, trying to give you a break since you're overworked in real life and so forth. You didn't seem all that open to my challenge/it wouldn't be fun to challenge you if we both couldn't have fun with the role-play etc etc plus our current role-play where Tomi's asking Athos about the whereabouts of certain tailed beasts. Wouldn't fit things if I personally went and challenged you right now/I wouldn't want to go back on my word, yada yada.



This is just my personal opinion, I've always felt there should be a hard limit regardless of who was going over it. It was suggested you might redistribute them yourself at some time in the future so I was willing to wait to suggest a hard limit myself after/if you did so.

If a rule was made where there was a hard limit while you were 'over the limit', why not just create an event yourself where Athos goes about finding candidates to distribute the excess tailed beasts/make it public? You've fairly won them, so you should get to decide who they go to. Perhaps have some fun with it while you're at it. Mind you, this is just my suggestion and personal opinion. I respect your right and reason to disagree with me, and hope it doesn't put a damper on our friendship.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2017, 08:59:10 PM by Timothy »
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Rusaku

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2017, 08:58:23 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.

Yes because if someone had challenged you, lost, then made this topic, you totally wouldn't be calling them a cry baby right now. You're going to be upset no matter how this topic is presented, so you might as well take a back seat and try to defend your case on why there shouldn't be a limit instead of insisting everything is a personal attack on you. 

If you look at the tailed beast page right now, you're going to see 3 people holding all 11 different entities associated with tailed beasts. 8 of them belong to a single person. That person is currently only using the nine tails for anything that can be observed currently. Certainly we can assume he is trying to create the ten tails or something, but it's highly debatable on if the ten tails is even going to be an accepted mechanic in SL. One major village already voids beasts entirely, and I'm sure others will follow suit if they stay true to old habits. It's already been discussed that the Biju scene is losing steam, which I can guess is linked to how fights are currently handled, and how a single individual can monopolize the different beasts. If we remove the possibility of a person getting more than 1 or maybe 2 beasts, then maybe more people will be encouraged to join the fights again. 
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Timothy

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2017, 09:01:17 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.

Yes because if someone had challenged you, lost, then made this topic, you totally wouldn't be calling them a cry baby right now. You're going to be upset no matter how this topic is presented, so you might as well take a back seat and try to defend your case on why there shouldn't be a limit instead of insisting everything is a personal attack on you. 

If you look at the tailed beast page right now, you're going to see 3 people holding all 11 different entities associated with tailed beasts. 8 of them belong to a single person. That person is currently only using the nine tails for anything that can be observed currently. Certainly we can assume he is trying to create the ten tails or something, but it's highly debatable on if the ten tails is even going to be an accepted mechanic in SL. One major village already voids beasts entirely, and I'm sure others will follow suit if they stay true to old habits. It's already been discussed that the Biju scene is losing steam, which I can guess is linked to how fights are currently handled, and how a single individual can monopolize the different beasts. If we remove the possibility of a person getting more than 1 or maybe 2 beasts, then maybe more people will be encouraged to join the fights again.

In all fairness, Athos has already stated/admitted he can't make the 10 tails. No Rinnegan means no access to the coffin seal, etc etc. Just putting this out there in his defense to help clarify things.
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Rusaku

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2017, 09:11:20 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.

Yes because if someone had challenged you, lost, then made this topic, you totally wouldn't be calling them a cry baby right now. You're going to be upset no matter how this topic is presented, so you might as well take a back seat and try to defend your case on why there shouldn't be a limit instead of insisting everything is a personal attack on you. 

If you look at the tailed beast page right now, you're going to see 3 people holding all 11 different entities associated with tailed beasts. 8 of them belong to a single person. That person is currently only using the nine tails for anything that can be observed currently. Certainly we can assume he is trying to create the ten tails or something, but it's highly debatable on if the ten tails is even going to be an accepted mechanic in SL. One major village already voids beasts entirely, and I'm sure others will follow suit if they stay true to old habits. It's already been discussed that the Biju scene is losing steam, which I can guess is linked to how fights are currently handled, and how a single individual can monopolize the different beasts. If we remove the possibility of a person getting more than 1 or maybe 2 beasts, then maybe more people will be encouraged to join the fights again.

In all fairness, Athos has already stated/admitted he can't make the 10 tails. No Rinnegan means no access to the coffin seal, etc etc. Just putting this out there in his defense to help clarify things.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what he's trying to do. Gyu's question is a considerable one: How is him hoarding all the beasts benefiting RP? There is far more to be gained by diversifying the host list than there is not to. 
 
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Timothy

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2017, 09:20:08 PM »

Personally I would prefer a hard limit on how many tailed beasts one person could own at a time. It would help to diversify the potential kinds of battles we could read. I do feel excitement for the possibilities of such. At most, a summoner could bring out & control up to 4 tailed beasts & have their chakra completely exhausted by doing so with current rules. Three would take them down to 75%, etc.

Why don't you take some beasts from me and give them out to people then?

I'm sorry but so far the topic consists of people who have never even challenged me and people who have directly lost bijuu because of me suggest that I should lose beasts I've fairly won and defended and that just smacks of being disingenuous.

If you want a bijuu at least try and win one before complaining the rules need to be changed so you can have one without fighting me for it.

Yes because if someone had challenged you, lost, then made this topic, you totally wouldn't be calling them a cry baby right now. You're going to be upset no matter how this topic is presented, so you might as well take a back seat and try to defend your case on why there shouldn't be a limit instead of insisting everything is a personal attack on you. 

If you look at the tailed beast page right now, you're going to see 3 people holding all 11 different entities associated with tailed beasts. 8 of them belong to a single person. That person is currently only using the nine tails for anything that can be observed currently. Certainly we can assume he is trying to create the ten tails or something, but it's highly debatable on if the ten tails is even going to be an accepted mechanic in SL. One major village already voids beasts entirely, and I'm sure others will follow suit if they stay true to old habits. It's already been discussed that the Biju scene is losing steam, which I can guess is linked to how fights are currently handled, and how a single individual can monopolize the different beasts. If we remove the possibility of a person getting more than 1 or maybe 2 beasts, then maybe more people will be encouraged to join the fights again.

In all fairness, Athos has already stated/admitted he can't make the 10 tails. No Rinnegan means no access to the coffin seal, etc etc. Just putting this out there in his defense to help clarify things.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what he's trying to do. Gyu's question is a considerable one: How is him hoarding all the beasts benefiting RP? There is far more to be gained by diversifying the host list than there is not to.

True enough, like I pointed out. With current rules you can't possibly summon and control more than 4 at one time. Reasonably speaking, two would be the limit as you'd still have half chakra to work with and your other techniques still count against the drain in practice. Not to mention the hard action limit per turn being 3.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2017, 09:21:12 PM by Timothy »
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Hazama

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #12 on: April 28, 2017, 09:27:07 PM »

Let's start by making it clear that this topic will not be taking in votes to determine if a "1 Bijuu per player" limit should or shouldn't be enforced, but a discussion on the matter. So please tell state your current view on the matter instead of bring up the thread where everyone simply voted "yes" or "no".

I believe that no player should be allowed to hold onto more than 1 Bijuu unless it is for a event which later redistribute them to new owners. Anyone who manages to monopolize something gets corrupted, whether they admit it or not. Is there any reason why a player should be allowed to hold onto multiple Bijuu? How does that situation benefits RP?

If anyone find themselves in possession of more than one Bijuu due to RP reasons, they should be urged to let go of one within a time frame of let's say 3 months tops.

-1

I know that I'm the most bias party here, but I don't see the point. The more Bijuu a person has, I.E me, then the more difficult it is to defend them all. You know, when people actually go around and challenge someone.
How many Bijuu someone wants should depend on how much of a hassle they are willing to deal with >> Simple as that. Instead of making a rule that says 'Nah, you can't collect', why not just go out and do something about it instead?

Because Biju should be used as tools to foster new and interesting roleplays, which is something that SL desperately needs.

We discussed that you were going to distribute the Biju to some of the "lower tier" roleplayers on the site to do just that. Those people can't "go out and do something about it" and likely have no interest when the only people who hold biju are the super competitive world-breaker types.

Yeah but those are not the people who are complaining right now. Gyu and Tomi were some of the most notoriously OP characters back in the day, Rusaku was just recently insisting his Tenseigan should not only be twice as strong as the buff Sage Mode gives you but with that and it's additional powers it was less powerful then Sage Mode. You, Vail, with your ability to make robots, cyborgs, nano-machines and whatever else via the Asura Path in addition to the fact that you're probably the most academically intelligent person I've met on the site let you fight Bocchiere to a draw at his most powerful.

Well, truth be told, I was going to be honest. I don't really care about capturing the rest of the Bijuu, it is to the point that I've gotten my point across to everyone. I was serious, am serious, about trying to make the Bijuu mean something.

I was also going to confess that, without saying what it is, that I have a list of hosts, a list that TIm has seen(and I'm pretty sure Tobi has, too). But even with me planning to hand out the Bijuu, putting a total limit on the amount of Bijuu is pointless.

Not only does it take away that bit of realism we look for in our fights/IC, but it isn't like anyone has the reason to do it. Everyone has been assuming that I've been collecting the beasts for selfish reasons and this isn't where I plan on denying that, but that isn't the only reason. From the beginning, people close to me have known what the long term goal for all this is, even if I look like... Well, an asshole bitch, in the process.

But I have faith that with the IC rules, and with the redistribution, we can actually make Bijuu mean something again >> Whether you believe me or not is entirely up to you but that's the truth. I haven't had a lot of time lately but it seems I need to put more effort in, because that'll be the only way something gets done. If we stick to it.

In the end I don't think there needs to be a hard limit on beasts you can have but if, after redistribution, people still feel the need to do it then I wouldn't be against it as long as you're allowed 2-3 beasts.

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Timothy

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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #13 on: April 28, 2017, 10:32:28 PM »

This is from Ryujin/Copyninja also known as Logan. He had an interest in this topic but still has yet to get his forum application approved.


So, on behalf of all my experience on nearly a dozen RP sites, both Forum based and LOTGD based, my opinion would be that there isn't a 'hard cap' set, but more of a moral limit. How I saw many of the high tier players run with multiple beasts was that the strain of all of them being in their control caused the character to have psychosis occur. That being said though, it could be similar to what I myself did while 'hoarding' the beasts on a few of those servers. I gathered all of the beasts and the day after the final RP occurred, I called for a Kage Summit, and gave each country several beasts, and enforced that they not subject their enemies to a war using the beasts for X amount of months. If that were to occur on SL, you could have the Kages house the beasts within the village, and safeguard them for two months before it is sealed into a host, allowing 'newbies' the ability to interact with the beast, and maybe set them on a path to someday fight and attain one of them. In doing that, it could create an influx of RPers striving to show how they measure up, which would push the current 'OP' players to a new summit and the option to teach the next generation of players, or turn the place they once looked forward to being, in turn, becoming stagnant and slowly die off due to inactivity.

Granted so far, if it seems like a ramble, I don't mean to do so, the days of little rest due to work or helping friends with several games has caused both my 'filter' and brain to become nearly burned out. In closing, I vote that we don't set a concrete rule, but more of a subtle hint to the population that if you strive to gather all the beasts, do so with people you enjoy being around, and see yourself even wanting to fight beside and protect, like how the Spartans protected their fellow soldiers. But the most important thing to take from SL, is to enjoy the community and enjoy the overall experience and veiled lessons in writing skills and even the movement of the human body, by acting out the physical movements of each post, seeing and feeling the strain it may put on the body to add to the realism of each fight.

P.S./ TLDR; I vote that we simply enforce the idea that we limit the player ratio to 1:1 and allow groups of individual players, not alternates, to gather them, much like Akatsuki did, but also ensure they don't simply overwhelm combatants vying to attain the beasts.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2017, 10:35:52 PM by Timothy »
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Re: Limiting Bijuu Ownership (Discussion)
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2017, 11:19:55 PM »

One whole village voids the beasts? People stopped wanting to do beast stuff before the current guys had all the power. What drove them off? The dogs kicked down want to stop getting kicked, but wanna do all the kicking when they get back up. What about the trade thing as a place for fight rp to start back up? What about sportsmanship in official fights, that whole thing gonna make a comeback? What about the ic rules, are they good for a vote now, or is condition to limit biju monopolies first?

I say a limit of 3-4, just cause there might be empty spots for beasts if we only let 1 for 1.
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