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Author Topic: Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread  (Read 2925 times)

Jestar

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Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread
« on: July 23, 2017, 05:57:20 PM »

Thought I sent a PM about it, but I'm not gonna spend 5 days beating a horse. I'll make the post here so you both can respond at your leisure.

My issues with Jay's post are that his bakuton armor did not respond to stepping into the mud swamp nor with getting close to someone using chidori nagashi. The bakuton armor so far has been shown to respond automatically to chakra based attacks  coming into contact with Ray. The dark release technique that he used also requires the use of two hands (he only used one without extra reason) and from what I see in the movie depiction does not cause as much crippling damage as the post suggests.

Other than that I've already got a response in mind,  was just waiting on the judge's opinion on these, apparently in vain if he didn't get my PM, so sorry about that.

Edit: "Don't be alarmed, but I fixed the subject header from Jay to Ray, since it was confusing me and a bunch of other people were probably confused with the typo." -Camelicious
« Last Edit: July 23, 2017, 07:47:11 PM by Camel »
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Vail

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Re: Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2017, 07:30:58 PM »

You're correct in that Ray's Bakuton Armor seemingly responds automatically to any foreign chakra and attempts to harm him. In fact, he explicitly states in the post in which he created it that: "In the way it was created anything that touched ray would be violently repelled away from him in an explosion."

Anything means just that, so the raiton and the Doton mud both should produce explosions that propagate outward from the armor itself. How you decide to respond to that is up to you, but I'm giving Ray the opportunity to repost if he wants.

As for the revival fist, it's clear based on what Jay wrote that he's using the super revival fist. Additionally, the page itself says that the regular revival fist causes "tremendous internal damage" and the Super Revival Fist hits with "tremendous bone-shattering force". Presumably the latter is a stronger version of the original technique, so Ray's description of it seems appropriate to me.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2017, 07:52:51 PM by Camel »
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Jestar

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Re: Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2017, 06:39:31 AM »


... As for the revival fist, it's clear based on what Jay wrote that he's using the super revival fist. Additionally, the page itself says that the regular revival fist causes "tremendous internal damage" and the Super Revival Fist hits with "tremendous bone-shattering force". Presumably the latter is a stronger version of the original technique, so Ray's description of it seems appropriate to me.

Well, using Jay's repost for highlight, I think my confusion can be seen at least:

Original ~
The orb, if it hits Jestar, would create a shock wave that would cause severe internal damage, likely throwing his organs around inside him, which would be more than any one could handle and easily kill. In addition, the shockwave caused by the orb, correctly known as Revival Fist, would send the man flying with plenty of force that he'd attain damage from every bounce he'd make on the ground.

New ~

The orb, if it hits Jestar, would create a shock wave that would cause severe internal damage, likely throwing his organs around inside him, which would be more than any one could handle and easily kill. In addition, the shockwave caused by the orb, correctly known as Super Revival Fist, would send the man flying with plenty of force that he'd attain damage from every bounce he'd make on the ground...

He described the Super version from the get-go, yes, but called it the regular version, hence my confusion. And bone-shattering force and organ jumbling are not the same thing though they are not far off. Jestar could take the hit to his side and, with bone shatteirng force, lose a few ribs and some serious internal bleeding, but not get his intestines knocked out of place; if Jestar takes that hit to the side with organ displacing force, his intestines might find themselves playing pingpong with the spine and abdominal muscles, with a kidney as a wild ball thrown into the court.

One of those is lethal, one of those is not in this context. Bone shattering and organ sloshing can both be considered tremendous internal damage (the latter obviously more extreme) so naturally I wanted to be clear on which Jestar has to deal with before deciding between my options.

*I'd like to add that, in Jay's repost, only a single explosion occurs as a result of his stepping into the doton swamp. Since the armor reforms everytime it is triggered and the doton swamp with some bits of Raiton constantly beneath him, shouldn't there be more than one explosion if not a constant chain of explosions that disrupt his footing more than just a little bit? After all the explosions were strong enough to destroy streams of Raiton, and anywhere his feet touch the swamp technique the armor should be triggered if I understand this armor right.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 06:49:54 AM by Jestar »
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Iburi Ray

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Re: Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2017, 06:57:57 AM »

No because one explosion is used. If I used chakra to refill it then yes.
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Vail

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Re: Ray v Jestar 7-tails fight discussion thread
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2017, 05:16:53 PM »


... As for the revival fist, it's clear based on what Jay wrote that he's using the super revival fist. Additionally, the page itself says that the regular revival fist causes "tremendous internal damage" and the Super Revival Fist hits with "tremendous bone-shattering force". Presumably the latter is a stronger version of the original technique, so Ray's description of it seems appropriate to me.

Well, using Jay's repost for highlight, I think my confusion can be seen at least:

Original ~
The orb, if it hits Jestar, would create a shock wave that would cause severe internal damage, likely throwing his organs around inside him, which would be more than any one could handle and easily kill. In addition, the shockwave caused by the orb, correctly known as Revival Fist, would send the man flying with plenty of force that he'd attain damage from every bounce he'd make on the ground.

New ~

The orb, if it hits Jestar, would create a shock wave that would cause severe internal damage, likely throwing his organs around inside him, which would be more than any one could handle and easily kill. In addition, the shockwave caused by the orb, correctly known as Super Revival Fist, would send the man flying with plenty of force that he'd attain damage from every bounce he'd make on the ground...

He described the Super version from the get-go, yes, but called it the regular version, hence my confusion. And bone-shattering force and organ jumbling are not the same thing though they are not far off. Jestar could take the hit to his side and, with bone shatteirng force, lose a few ribs and some serious internal bleeding, but not get his intestines knocked out of place; if Jestar takes that hit to the side with organ displacing force, his intestines might find themselves playing pingpong with the spine and abdominal muscles, with a kidney as a wild ball thrown into the court.

One of those is lethal, one of those is not in this context. Bone shattering and organ sloshing can both be considered tremendous internal damage (the latter obviously more extreme) so naturally I wanted to be clear on which Jestar has to deal with before deciding between my options.

*I'd like to add that, in Jay's repost, only a single explosion occurs as a result of his stepping into the doton swamp. Since the armor reforms everytime it is triggered and the doton swamp with some bits of Raiton constantly beneath him, shouldn't there be more than one explosion if not a constant chain of explosions that disrupt his footing more than just a little bit? After all the explosions were strong enough to destroy streams of Raiton, and anywhere his feet touch the swamp technique the armor should be triggered if I understand this armor right.

The use of "bone shattering force" and "tremendous force" in this context is ambiguous, so attempting to deduce what kind of damage they would do would be arbitrary since we're not actually working with measurements in Newtons. Bone shattering force can very well be fatal by the way, but that's neither here nor there.

In response to Ray's post above me:

"As the electricity traveled to him, the moment it touched the layer of bakuton armor, an explosion would occur forcefully destroying the electricity arcs as they came in contact with his body. Just as fast as the explosions happen, they reformed to make sure no spots were left open for the Nara to capitalize on."

Ray, you never wrote that you have to consciously use your chakra to reform the barrier. The implication is that this happens automatically, so yes, I agree with Jestar that it would produce a larger (and more explosions) than you alluded to in your repost.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2017, 05:21:00 PM by Vail »
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