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Author Topic: Bijuu Council May 2012  (Read 6935 times)

Ace

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Bijuu Council May 2012
« on: May 20, 2012, 02:00:03 AM »

And disaster from my end.

I officially "resign" from keeping "abuse" and such to a minimum by counting votes sent to me.
All I will say is, the staff's priority is keeping information safe- that we have been doing and will continue to do.

Since the staff does not have full control over this voting process (so we can quietly remove people breaking the voting rules made by the members to avoid any harassment, to avoid people knowing whose alt was whose, etc..), my hands are now tied.

Why?
Well, some members (or quite a few) running on the council are not following the rules themselves. Besides the fact there has been voting from same households or the same person (seven or so members), there are some people on the council who either belong to the same person or the same household.

Now, up to you guys to decide what to do (following the forum poll would be the nest best option I guess).
Sorry guys, I am, but staff cannot share information on who the candidates are or whose alt is who, etc...

EDIT::
The purpose of this thread is NOT make those people running on the council admit something they might not know, or something they might know. It is not to box some people in (clearly as no names were provided). This does involve the top nine, this does involve members voting for candidates they should not be because either one person is controlling multiple accounts OR multiple people are using the same PC and the same internet.

I simply think it's best to simply figure out plan C or plan D now. =)
Plans never run out, good thing right?
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 02:08:01 AM by Ace »
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Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2012, 02:05:10 AM »

Then all there would need to be done is simply void the votes. If that's the case, leave the candidates alone and make sure not more than one voting for each ip was allowed. That way you don't really reveal anything. just void alts votes. But if you're gonna resign, I guess that's it. Thank you for the help thus far. I guess we'll end up going with a poll that according to you is half the way wrong. xD
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Raifudo Oppa

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2012, 02:08:58 AM »

Heard, mate.

That kind of topples everything, really. Took about a week or two off of discussing anything for the sake of the council being formed -- and we find out a good sum of them are the same people or voted for themselves.

I guess we can make the excuse of: "They wanted to be in the council so bad that they went the extra mile to get in." That's the desperation talking, though.

@ Rares;

That's the problem, voiding all the things that go against the rules we set. A bit much of work, y'know?
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Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2012, 02:13:13 AM »

*thinks rai should be made a mod and forced to do it >>*
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Ace

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2012, 02:30:53 AM »

Then all there would need to be done is simply void the votes. If that's the case, leave the candidates alone and make sure not more than one voting for each ip was allowed. That way you don't really reveal anything. just void alts votes. But if you're gonna resign, I guess that's it. Thank you for the help thus far. I guess we'll end up going with a poll that according to you is half the way wrong. xD

Example:

My main character is Ace, the other accounts from my household are account2, account3, and account4.

All four are running on the council.
Well, first off, if I was running this, I would remove all four of the above running to be on the council. :P

Secondly, I am only here to count the votes and void any votes that break the rules set by the member.

With that said, since I am using staff abilities, I have to take into account making sure that others do not know which household or person controls which accounts. If I remove three out of the four above accounts running for council, well, obviously members know that those three removed belong to the same household or person.

Finally, say there is Account1 and Account2. How do I know which one to remove? =)

My time was clearly wasted on this. A lot of time. I have the right to be pissed.
If members knew the characters that were breaking the voting rules or **running to be a council member rules**, well... that's up to those who did so decide if they would like to share or not.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 02:35:34 AM by Ace »
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Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2012, 02:36:13 AM »

Well, there's also the option to remove the votes of both accounts, given that they DID break the rules. It's understandable that those running can't be removed for obvious reasons.

It really bothers me to know that people would go and do such a thing in spite of knowing they will be checked and being made well aware of the ip/id rule.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 02:43:55 AM by Uchiha, Rares »
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cmage

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2012, 03:04:59 AM »

Meh, I know I'm fine >__> but there weren't any rules saying that two people from the same household couldn't run; just that they couldn't vote from the same IP.
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Ace

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2012, 05:54:09 AM »

Meh, I know I'm fine >__> but there weren't any rules saying that two people from the same household couldn't run; just that they couldn't vote from the same IP.

I never ever said two people same the same household could not run. ;)

Those candidates running for the council, specifically those handful, thanks for wasting my time.
Yes, I volunteered, time still wasted.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 06:03:05 AM by Ace »
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Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2012, 06:26:24 AM »

Well here is a list of options we could opt for and my opinion in regards to each:

Just go with the poll - we could just later kick out if others proved to be unworthy, but the thought of council members that cheated being accepted is mind bothering... It could also result in people not trusting said council.

Just scrap the poll and figure some way to make it right - too time consuming and what not. Possibly extremely hard as well. We're also out of highly trusted volunteers.

And finally the best suggestion I could come up with: I am sure that even though a lot of people don't like at least two of us, it is very clear that the top 3 would make it in the council hands down, in essence, me Zen and Rai could gather up and elect 4-6 other members. Voting is simpler since we're just 3, there is not much way for abuse, and we are generally trusted by the majority.
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KayentaMoenkopi

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #9 on: May 20, 2012, 01:22:35 PM »

Well if the election is a bust then I think the whole thing should be scraped.

Just to say Rare, Raifudo and Zenaku and then whoever they appoint...that puts us right back at the beginning before the election when Rares and Raifudo decided to dissolve the council. This is unsatisfactory to me. We had the election to figure out what do to because of that mess that was created through the take over. I for one am not willing to just say...
ok the election didn't work, just  go with the take over and hush it.


Go back to how it used to be run and then behave yourselves. People who are eligible to serve being one of the three ways...

Jinchuuriki
Kage
and add in, if you like...
Village Appointment

You look at the list. It is not gonna change all that much. And those who wish to serve just do it. We all know that basically anyone can watch a match and call autohitting, god modding, metagaming and those sort of things.

The rules are already made so that doesn't have to be redone.

Truthfully? There was nothing wrong with the council to begin with. It was not inactive, just claimed to be so. Council members were active moderating bijuu matches the whole time. When an issue was brought up everyone came out and debated the heck out of it anyway.

The biggest thing the council has to do is moderate bijuu matches. You don't need every member on the council for that. Just one who is online at the time. That was the beauty of a large list. Many possible names of people who would probably be on line when needed.

Then if you don' t like the ruling given get a second opinion from another council member. Three max to avoid a stalemate.

If any huge changes to rules have to be made you can get people together just like was done for this whole revamp.

Anyone can judge a bijuu match as long as both people agree to it. You don't really need an official council meeting for that until a huge disagreement occurs.



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Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #10 on: May 20, 2012, 02:27:48 PM »

Well if the election is a bust then I think the whole thing should be scraped.

Just to say Rare, Raifudo and Zenaku and then whoever they appoint...that puts us right back at the beginning before the election when Rares and Raifudo decided to dissolve the council. This is unsatisfactory to me. We had the election to figure out what do to because of that mess that was created through the take over. I for one am not willing to just say...
ok the election didn't work, just  go with the take over and hush it.


Go back to how it used to be run and then behave yourselves. People who are eligible to serve being one of the three ways...

Jinchuuriki
Kage
and add in, if you like...
Village Appointment

You look at the list. It is not gonna change all that much. And those who wish to serve just do it. We all know that basically anyone can watch a match and call autohitting, god modding, metagaming and those sort of things.

The rules are already made so that doesn't have to be redone.

Truthfully? There was nothing wrong with the council to begin with. It was not inactive, just claimed to be so. Council members were active moderating bijuu matches the whole time. When an issue was brought up everyone came out and debated the heck out of it anyway.

The biggest thing the council has to do is moderate bijuu matches. You don't need every member on the council for that. Just one who is online at the time. That was the beauty of a large list. Many possible names of people who would probably be on line when needed.

Then if you don' t like the ruling given get a second opinion from another council member. Three max to avoid a stalemate.

If any huge changes to rules have to be made you can get people together just like was done for this whole revamp.

Anyone can judge a bijuu match as long as both people agree to it. You don't really need an official council meeting for that until a huge disagreement occurs.

And that just brings us back to the point of some of those clearly not being fit, not all past jinchuriki and kage being eligible, etc, and we just keep going back and forth. Since we bothered so much and wasted so much time, while seeing just how few people opted for the old council we might as well figure out a way to make it work.

But if we were to actually go with the old council, something I and quite a few clearly oppose(poll and threads based), I'd at least suggest a major clean up in regards to the clearly inactive and clearly non-eligible(reputed for barely being average, to put it nicely). Given that we would decide things vote wise, it should be a majority thing while that's kinda hard when the active members aren't even a majority(exaggeration).
Again, since things would go down through votes and what not, those with the ability to vote on such as council members should at the very least be widely trusted for their rp skill, insight, and input value. <- That's a suggestion if we are to (god forbid) go with the old council. 

To sum it all up, an active, globally acknowledge, and respected council, should be made out of such people only in order to work.

Well, I've put my two cents in on the matter so many times so far that if someone was to collect them all he/she would become a billionaire. That's my opinion, I suppose I will go with whatever is decided, my participation in it depending on such.

EDIT:

As a matter of fact, going with the council from the voting does not seem like such a bad idea. Many of the said abuses were people leveling the accounts of others or so they claim, I know at least some of them are exactly such. So the amount of abuse is probably way lower, well WE have yet to decide what to do.

As for the nothing being wrong with it - chaos could rise from the "unexperienced"(I am VERY generous) passing poor judgement. Then people would go, well he is a council member so I believed him.

Now this here is a personal opinion: if a council has the members A B C D E (number is fairly accurate) that are badly renown, unacknowledged, viewed as worthless by many, then that council as a whole is no better.  I would find it a disgrace for any respectable rp'er to be part of such a council. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if people did not want to acknowledge it.
As for the activity you stated, at least 2 or 3 members were inactive and a whole lot more not really doing moderation as what not cause they aren't all that acknowledged to begin with or simply do not care. And for the sake of pointing out errors:
Raiken is listed as active member and as living large in retirement also. I think that's an error unless I misunderstood the meaning.

Please try to keep you opinions as suggestions, I felt that rather than that, you were imposing in your last post. Sorry if I mistook that though.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 06:37:27 PM by Uchiha, Rares »
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Nathan

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2012, 06:41:40 PM »

I don't see the point in this council -- or any council for that matter -- anyways. If you haven't noticed, all that ha come out of this is anger, chaos, and arguing. There was nothing wrong when we had no council because trusted people such as Rai', Zenaku, Rare, and Kayenta would just moderate the matches. The only real problem I saw was that the rules needed to be updated, but why was a council needed for that? It seems to me that every one was perfectly discussing the rules in that one topic.

Uchiha, Rares

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2012, 07:26:51 PM »

Well according to Kay, a council did exist, hell I was even called out for not being a member of it. Yes, the four you mentioned are trusted people, often relied to for input. And I'm being honest when I say that whenever I brought the lover half of that council up to people all I got was "lolwut?" and "I never acknowledged those". Not one singly positive thing, best case scenario, they would not care much for the council in general.

So yeah, regardless of being on the council or not, the people come to with issues or simply for advice, would stay the very same. One could say, why even care if people don't acknowledge them anyway? Well why have them there if such is the case? Isn't it supposed to contain highly competent people? I would have no issues with Rai being the one making the rules while taking input from everyone else, it was such at one point in the past if I am not mistaken and it presented no issues at all. Furthermore, non-well reputed/knowledgeable/highly competent people being in such a formation and having council member vote rights, would result in bad results overall.

If it's not obvious enough, split it in two. Put Rai, Zen, me, Kay in one and leave the rest with their own, completely projecting rules and what not while independent of one another, see which one is more relied on, respected, and acknowledged. The outcome would be obvious.

Edit: In case such was not clear, I won't want to be apart/get added to a council if such does stay as the old one and keeps the lower half(most of you if not all, know who I'm talking about at least partially if not entirely) I keep going on about. As said, the supposed old council simply has a bad base, some villages simply lacked competent people and had to go with the best from a mass of non eligible shinobi, some got appointed as jinchuriki as a cruel joke, some got jinchuriki from said jokes while some just are not respected nor trusted. It's true that people had the habit of going to kage and jinchuriki for advice, but to those they deemed as fit for such. The in balance with that, me and Rai were called out by some on corruption and what the hell not, Rai and Zen were dealing with it on their own for a whole while, I was often come to for advice, at first just calling it off on lacking authority but later on, ceased doing such. As said, it won't really change anything, the trusted and viewed as eligible will stay the same, the opposite, same story, they'll just have some supposed seat of sorts. So yeah, seeing that things may turn a take for the worst, I would refrain from sharing my input here any further, no point in me keeping to act like a member to something I'm not or don't want to be. I'll just keep doing my thing, aiding those that ask for help(god knows, even those that don't but drastically need it. xD) be it some poor god modes that have a will to change or a combatant from a jinchuriki battle that didn't find anyone he deemed as better online. I guess you could call this a letter of resignation to something, I was supposedly never a part of while some many deem as unworthy were. Lastly, I am only stating this so that my actions will be known in every case. Due to some players, probably including myself, a way to big issue was made out of a rewriting of a bad council. I want that to stop already, enough is enough, etc. Yet, I wouldn't trust that EVERYONE will refrain from comments that will make me feel as if forced to counter, and as such, the only solution I see to this is to stop coming here at least until the matter is settled. So yeah, to sum it up, hit me up if you ever decide to go with a new council of sorts or at least scrap those that obviously need to be scrapped. I didn't really state their names, cause I can't do so w/o elaboration nor can I elaborate w/o being offensive, that and the fact that much everyone knows who those are. Sorry for overly repeating myself. Ciao~ Kisses! :D
« Last Edit: May 20, 2012, 11:48:18 PM by Uchiha, Rares »
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UettoSenju

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2012, 08:05:05 AM »

Well this sort of blows... I just wanted to see how many damn votes I would get from the pmed ones (never really cared to be apart of a council).  And considering I am a one account kind of person that doesn't even believe alts should be allowed at the site it ticks me off that there was cheating and now I don't get to see how many votes I racked up.  In all honesty if I would have somehow magically made this council I was just gonna decline membership afterwards anyways. In the end I could careless if a council is formed or not, or who is on said council; however I do hate that Ace had to put in worthless effort for something (I see) as such petty bs as this turned out to be. Perhaps the bijuu should just be voided and no council would be needed from the get-go.
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KayentaMoenkopi

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Re: Bijuu Council May 2012
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2012, 09:51:16 AM »

Please try to keep you opinions as suggestions, I felt that rather than that, you were imposing in your last post. Sorry if I mistook that though.

Oh that makes me laugh as it is a common complaint that I have faced time and time again. Tone of voice is such a hard thing to translate via text.

During college they beat such phrases out of me like, "In my opinion" or "I think" or "I feel" because in scientific writing, or even just debate, those phrase were described to me as invalid for they lessen the power of the words you are using when you state it as opinion and in scientific reporting your opinions don't matter, they just want the facts and data you have collected or observed.

And anyway, as such, my casual writing suffers greatly because it always comes across as being so stern and pushy.

Anyway Kirk has a good idea. I hate the bijuu and always have. Let's just get rid of them.

Or...*evil grin as the thought has been posed*...let's just dump the whole mess back into Kamui's lap.
This is all his fault and I feel that would be just punishment for his crimes against humanity, vampires, demons, neko kitty, and ginger snap what the fawks.

Nathan has the right of it though. It works just fine on its own mostly. Why bother with a council at all?

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