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Author Topic: Proposal  (Read 11152 times)

Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2015, 02:33:33 AM »

All these ideas have a lot of merit.

and here is another idea.

What if...the Bijuu were just a status thing that people fought over and had nothing to do with RP.

then they would be removed and still here.

Like...no one would care. You win or lose and take care of the rp without having a drama all the time.

Imagine!

I fight...I lose. It's someone else's problem.
I go back to my regularly scheduled rp. no big deal.

And the rest of us say to you, have at it but we don't ever want to hear about another bijuu drama again.

You are the host, figure it out? get along or get over it or get going! It's none of my business, I got stuff to do!

Then if you have a problem with bad behavior, you petition and SL mod and let them handle it and leave the rest of SL out of it.

the community gets of crowd control, the GMs get back to RP and we all try to have fun.

And the mods handle the 'issues' and everyone acts like they are functional and user friendly.

Sounds like an OOC biju fight in a nutshell, except I couldn't use its powers even in an IC fight. I say don't even leave them as empty status symbols though, because really, that is what they'd become. Might as well go that extra step and just dump them altogether.
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2015, 02:54:26 AM »

I like the idea of an underground self moderated fight club though.

It is cool when it works.

Call it a try out?

If after a certain number of successful matches you then get to claim a prize...

One tail Proto-bijuu that no one can ever take from you....

incentives for successful bijuu rp.

you can't use the powers in RP until you earn them.

something to help this travesty...anything.

Removing a tumor is normally more effective than trying to convince the cells to behave.  :-?

As such, removing the tailed beasts would solve this particular travesty once and for all. Anything less than removal is a band-aide as far as I'm concerned.
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Garō, Ichirou

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2015, 03:03:18 AM »

I don't think the Biju within themselves are the problem, it's people not willing to get along. Either way I feel like if the Biju go a lot of activity will go too,
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2015, 03:11:07 AM »

I don't think the Biju within themselves are the problem, it's people not willing to get along. Either way I feel like if the Biju go a lot of activity will go too,

I disagree. Biju deliver a very miniscule amount of RP to the site. If you go about clan halls or just go onto the village boards, very little RP is even mildly related to tailed beasts. Me training Kokuo and such examples are few and far inbetween in the grand scheme of things.

The tailed beasts are the problem because people are forced to get along with each other in for them to exist fairly in this realm, despite anything and everything, which is not fun, and barely functional. We all have real lives where we can spend agonizing moments working with people we would rather drown in a well.

The tailed beassts
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Garō, Ichirou

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2015, 03:13:44 AM »

Yeah but I also see a lot of people who want to be hosts and who's action rp if filled with Biju challenges, If two people can't even cooperate for a Biju fight then neither of them should be the host to a beast, lol.
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Rusaku

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #20 on: January 17, 2015, 03:26:39 AM »

As a fellow Jink (Though of a lesser known entity due to it's recent addition) I vote for banning the Biju. While I like the Dark chakra cloak, I don't like the drama. The game would be better if they were just somehow sealed away in a pot and locked away into a kamui dimension. Then the Kamui eye was destroyed so the beasts were lost for all of eternity.
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #21 on: January 17, 2015, 03:31:30 AM »

Yeah but I also see a lot of people who want to be hosts and who's action rp if filled with Biju challenges, If two people can't even cooperate for a Biju fight then neither of them should be the host to a beast, lol.

I can't say I see similar things, especially when browsing over a few of the challenge lists.
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Garō, Ichirou

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #22 on: January 17, 2015, 03:33:08 AM »

Push come to shove I don't think they should be banned.
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Mei

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2015, 03:50:29 AM »

I agree with what Eric said earlier. If the Bijuu fights were OOC matches, it would be less drama and more fun. I mean, is a bijuu worth losing your life (of your character)?

I think the reason why some challenges have been IC is to "get rid" of certain characters that consistently challenge (and lose) to the jinchuuriki. So I guess it's kinda annoying fighting the same person over and over again. However, I believe there is a rule on how soon you can challenge a jinchuuriki again. Correct me if I'm wrong.

In addition, I think it should be more balanced. The nine tails is the strongest bijuu for obvious reason. I think the Jinchuuriki of the Nine tails should not have access to Nine Tails Chakra Mode and its forms. Keep it strictly bijuu cloak / transformations.

Kay's idea of making the bijuus into a "status / title" is interesting but what good is a title without any perks. Lol.
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #24 on: January 17, 2015, 03:54:27 AM »

And yet, Ichirou just got one and no doubt would like to finally have his chance to play. Fair is fair. I think a way to see it work should be the first goal. And perhaps the hand off approach is the way. The rule heavy plan has led us here.

In the days before Antibiotics, amputation was the answer Eric. Now we have modern medicine and people survive cancer all the time.

But if you want to throw away your bijuu then do it.
Be like the old bra burners of old and taste the freedom!!!



I suppose you make a point that it would be uncanny, but I largely hold to my main stances:

* Make them OOC so there is less baggage so that less is on the line. Should make the matches less tooth and nail. Having gone through both IC and OOC battles for biju, OOC is the way for me to go all the way.

* Get. Rid. Of. The. Beasts. After Ichirou's grace period. >_> I don't mind waiting.
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Warren

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2015, 04:04:08 AM »

Dump em if you wish. I won't.
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Kyutu - Super King -

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #26 on: January 17, 2015, 01:32:43 PM »

I wonder how many times I've seen this topic. "Positive Feelings" incoming.

As for whether or not the bijuu should be removed, I have no opinion. It's not like they themselves are the issue. They are just  the only real "symbol" a person/village has of power in this game, and so when there are fights centered around them then it makes them seem like the problem. Honestly though they are more of a... "location" I guess. Removing them won't remove power duels, it will just make the game a bit more shallow by removing one of the few tangible assets of SL RP. Removing it will make the complaints lessen a bit granted, but also the RP of any form. I wouldn't expect to see quite as many OOC challenges or anything anyway, there'd be no reason to accept them. More over people are going to need something else to fight for and fight over or else RP itself is pointless.


--Either way though, I wanted to post regarding an idea brought up earlier in this thread. The "I won't fight X-person list" idea.
I've rewritten my opinion on this four times now, because I'm trying to figure out how I want to say it:

ob·li·ga·tion
ˌäbləˈɡāSH(ə)n/
noun
an act or course of action to which a person is morally or legally bound; a duty or commitment.
"he has enough cash to meet his present obligations"
synonyms:   duty, commitment, responsibility, moral imperative; More

This is the thing you have when you decide to prove your character's power and worth and grab a bijuu. You have the obligation to fight to keep it. OOC/IC, Zero/One/Any, I don't care about the in game rules of the challenge enough to debate them right now. Where I'd have to draw a line is when you step outside the game and are able to say "I don't want to fight X". That's stupid.
Too strong? That's the point of the challenge in keeping your bijuu.
Don't like 'em? If you're petty enough you can't play a game with a person you don't like, a text game mind you with no voice feature or any way for any person to even pretend to "attack" another outside of pixels on a screen, you probably shouldn't have a bijuu with OBLIGATES you to play said game.
I can't think of any other reason to be able to individually ban challengers for something the point of which is to be able to be challenged for and rewarded/kept. I strongly suspect that even with that being the case, no reason IS legitimate enough to be able to shut individual people out without said shut-out needing to be banned from the game completely or something.
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #27 on: January 17, 2015, 04:42:37 PM »

... Removing them won't remove power duels, it will just make the game a bit more shallow by removing one of the few tangible assets of SL RP. Removing it will make the complaints lessen a bit granted, but also the RP of any form. I wouldn't expect to see quite as many OOC challenges or anything anyway, there'd be no reason to accept them. More over people are going to need something else to fight for and fight over or else RP itself is pointless.


--Either way though, I wanted to post regarding an idea brought up earlier in this thread. The "I won't fight X-person list" idea.
I've rewritten my opinion on this four times now, because I'm trying to figure out how I want to say it:

ob·li·ga·tion
ˌäbləˈɡāSH(ə)n/
noun
an act or course of action to which a person is morally or legally bound; a duty or commitment.
"he has enough cash to meet his present obligations"
synonyms:   duty, commitment, responsibility, moral imperative; More

This is the thing you have when you decide to prove your character's power and worth and grab a bijuu. You have the obligation to fight to keep it. OOC/IC, Zero/One/Any, I don't care about the in game rules of the challenge enough to debate them right now. Where I'd have to draw a line is when you step outside the game and are able to say "I don't want to fight X". That's stupid.
Too strong? That's the point of the challenge in keeping your bijuu.
Don't like 'em? If you're petty enough you can't play a game with a person you don't like, a text game mind you with no voice feature or any way for any person to even pretend to "attack" another outside of pixels on a screen, you probably shouldn't have a bijuu with OBLIGATES you to play said game.
I can't think of any other reason to be able to individually ban challengers for something the point of which is to be able to be challenged for and rewarded/kept. I strongly suspect that even with that being the case, no reason IS legitimate enough to be able to shut individual people out without said shut-out needing to be banned from the game completely or something.

I have to once again disagree with the idea that the tailed beasts add anything subtsantial to RP. As stated before, there are few people who actually go hunting for tailed beasts, and even fewer who seek the hassle/burden of being a host through any means. Hardly any RP is actually done with or over the tailed beasts at this point. Seriously, unless the hosts are doing their stuff in clan halls and stuff of that sort, I see very little mention of the tailed beasts in SL RP unless it is either brief interaction between host and beast or a titular mentioning.

Obligation, it's an interesting thing. Being a jinchurikii, I have to say, the RP rewards that are reaped from having a tailed beast are not worth the trouble. The tailed beasts are not valuable RP tools. As has been mentioned before, due to the very obligations that you speak of, the tailed beasts force people who don't want to RP with each other RP with each other. There is very little pay-off for these interactions, as again, most people in the realm do not even bother with the notion of tailed beasts.

This obligation, this job of sorts, does not have the proper pay on it. In a game, you should be enjoying what you're doing. These arguments, these fights, theses attempts at making this work, are not enjoyable at this point. The minimal amount of RP involved with the tailed beast, such as training it, is not worth it. The interactions of a few people to the host and the beast is not worth it.

At least not to me it is not worth it. Before the tailed beasts, there were plenty of things for peoplt to strive before. With the tailed beasts, there are a vast number of alternatives that people have been exploiting since fighting over them has gone to the courthouse. The tailed beasts being removed will not dramatically affect the quantity of RP because there was hardly any RP done with them worth all of the trouble to begin with. If anything, not having to worry about a stupid tailed beast will actually increase RP, since more resources would be devoted to alternative, and likely more fun, kinds of RP.

Official tailed beasts should be removed, because they add very little to the RP of the site compared to the amount of conflict that they stir and cause.

People will find other things to fight over. People will find something of value to go after; perhaps one of the most valuable commodities on the site at this stage are players, people. No clan, no division of RP, no village, can survive without people, without RPers. How about we try to compete to attract RPers? Whether that means playing a villain and raiding caravans (PvP missions become a thing) or making sure every day is filled with fun and festivity and intrigue. There are so many other options out there.

A global war could be a hoot if we put the same effort into finding a way to make it work that we do in bickering over who gets stripped and why and whether it is moral for this or that. Whether it's "fair" for this and that.

At this point in my rant, a suspension of the tailed beasts seems like a compromise at this point. Some people want a trial run to see just how much getting rid of the tailed beasts will actually change SL RP. A trial run of a few months is reasonable. I wouldn't mind it starting immediately (I will still finish my fight with Machina since she has been waiting so long, but beyond that, I will have no dealings with tailed beasts during the period) but if waiting a few weeks for these lingering battles to fade out or new ones to start is the desire, then I'm all for it.

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Kyutu - Super King -

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #28 on: January 17, 2015, 05:28:39 PM »

Snip

Concerning whether they stay or go, as I've already stated, I have no interest in. All I can see it doing is swallowing SL's RP a level, and giving a hit to some RP. If that trade off it worth other topics becoming the prominent "points of interest" to the community then so be it.

My main concern is indeed that if they were to stay, or  whatever else comes about to replace them, the whole "don't have to fight who you don't want to fight" notion. This game is already secular and "clique"-ish as is. Allowing people to decline to face others on whim with absolutely no repercussion in any sense, especially when in game stakes should reasonably be, well, at stake, is a deep nail in a coffin that's already a  few feet under compared to recent years. It's just starting to make a bit of a come back, it would be unsettling to have a precedent  of "comfort" over "game play", which is what such a "don't want to fight X" rule would be. Anti-RP. Similar notions are already ingrained in SL's  more casual RP, I don't think it would be a good idea to "officialise" it in the "larger" RP as well.
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Eric

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Re: Proposal
« Reply #29 on: January 17, 2015, 05:45:57 PM »

Snip

Concerning whether they stay or go, as I've already stated, I have no interest in. All I can see it doing is swallowing SL's RP a level, and giving a hit to some RP. If that trade off it worth other topics becoming the prominent "points of interest" to the community then so be it.

My main concern is indeed that if they were to stay, or  whatever else comes about to replace them, the whole "don't have to fight who you don't want to fight" notion. This game is already secular and "clique"-ish as is. Allowing people to decline to face others on whim with absolutely no repercussion in any sense, especially when in game stakes should reasonably be, well, at stake, is a deep nail in a coffin that's already a  few feet under compared to recent years. It's just starting to make a bit of a come back, it would be unsettling to have a precedent  of "comfort" over "game play", which is what such a "don't want to fight X" rule would be. Anti-RP. Similar notions are already ingrained in SL's  more casual RP, I don't think it would be a good idea to "officialise" it in the "larger" RP as well.

And how do you intend on stopping people from ignoring/rejecting other people? Regarding the tailed beasts, we can strip indefinitely until we get a set of hosts who are complacent and willing to abide by the fact that they must RP with anyone who challenges for a tailed beast. But how many people are really up for all that that implies? As you've mentioned, SL is kind of cliquey, but that's mostly because no one is obligated to RP by any set of rules with someone they don't want to outside of the tailed beasts, the only global objects that must be open to every player in SL at least in theory.

If they were to stay, then people would have to be forced to follow the rules or be stripped. I admit I've had a bleeding heart moment here and there, but making exceptions for the rules has always been an undermining of the point of the rules in the first place. Either you suck it up and do as you're told or you hand over the tailed beast.

There is not a particularly long list of people I know who are going to be jumping at the chance to be in those shoes.
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