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Death to the Wondertwins

10 (55.6%)

Life to the Wondertwins

5 (27.8%)

By your powers combined, I am Captain Planet! (Death)

3 (16.7%)

Total Members Voted: 18

Voting closed: September 15, 2015, 10:38:40 PM

[KayentaMoenkopi]

Now.

My original objection was two fold. And basically undecided.
1] Why be fine with Yujo doing the unsealing, saying Ichi's souls was split, and part being in the Edo body while the rest was in Hell, the Shinigam's belly, up unto the point when he backstabs? With their extensive knowledge of Edo Tensei and such, it should have been objected to right there. But no, they still thought he was doing them a favor and so no peeps were made. So they are kind of stuck with it.

On the other hand...

2] Since he did it wrong, character controlling the soul issue with Ichi, then why should they have to stick with that outcome.

HOWEVER

IF...Yujo was in fact not just making claims about Ichi's soul being split and in Hell, the Shinigami's belly...but was just blowing smoke at Masane and Ichi and waving flash mirrors around to fool them into thinking he was helping them...then bravo! Basically, he flaunts her very own jutsu in front of her, doing it wrong on purpose, with great side-show flare, and her character does not go wtf??? I say the RP is not voidable and must continue with the next person's turn.

As to the auto-hit of the sucking Masane into his seal. you do not have to void the rp to take care of that. Her next post merely counters his desired outcome with her action and what really is happening next.

As to the lying about the whole thing, OOC to the players and IC to their characters, that is what ninja do. We used to do it all the time in the clan wars, it is called subterfuge.

[Rusaku]

Now.

My original objection was two fold. And basically undecided.
1] Why be fine with Yujo doing the unsealing, saying Ichi's souls was split, and part being in the Edo body while the rest was in Hell, the Shinigam's belly, up unto the point when he backstabs? With their extensive knowledge of Edo Tensei and such, it should have been objected to right there. But no, they still thought he was doing them a favor and so no peeps were made. So they are kind of stuck with it.

On the other hand...

2] Since he did it wrong, character controlling the soul issue with Ichi, then why should they have to stick with that outcome.

HOWEVER

IF...Yujo was in fact not just making claims about Ichi's soul being split and in Hell, the Shinigami's belly...but was just blowing smoke at Masane and Ichi and waving flash mirrors around to fool them into thinking he was helping them...then bravo! Basically, he flaunts her very own jutsu in front of her, doing it wrong on purpose, with great side-show flare, and her character does not go wtf??? I say the RP is not voidable and must continue with the next person's turn.

As to the auto-hit of the sucking Masane into his seal. you do not have to void the rp to take care of that. Her next post merely counters his desired outcome with her action and what really is happening next.

As to the lying about the whole thing, OOC to the players and IC to their characters, that is what ninja do. We used to do it all the time in the clan wars, it is called subterfuge.

The question we have to ask though is this; If Yujo had stated that it "Could" have been Ichirou's soul as opposed to it "was" Ichirou's soul, would the outcome of this RP changed one bit? No, it would not have. With either choice I believe they would have continued with the RP no questions asked just like before and the sealing attempt would have occurred nonetheless. So to try and void the RP based on details that were misconstrued but in the end would have had zero affect on the outcome of the RP itself is just kinda silly to me.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

Yes, My point exactly.
"Basically, he flaunts her very own jutsu in front of her, doing it wrong on purpose, with great side-show flare, and her character does not go wtf??? I say the RP is not voidable and must continue with the next person's turn. "

They need to continue the RP.

[Masane]

Okay so I wont gonna say anything but this is crazy
I dont want it to be voided but if it is it should be voided on the grounds that yujo staight metagamed.  The only reason I accepted him knowing my character ic is because he lied ooc. Also, its my post in the rp so I can still see that he is doing this wrong and stop it.  I really am not shocked that its come to cheap op metagamed rp tactics to take us out.
I wanted it to contimue because I can stop this, and im going to.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

I guess you should have been more strict in the rp rules, not just when they benefit you.

metagaming is not right. But you permitted and agreed to it being fine. I can't tell you how many RP's I have had to go round and round to even establish certain details before I could finally get to the part of the RP i wanted to do first.

It's like, hey Joe come help me with this.

Uhm, Em, I can't cause we dont' know each other.

Oh geesh...well...what other reason could there be to get us together?

Hrm, nothing? Suna sucks and I never go there?

But...what if I was visiting my daughter in Ame and we bumped into each other?

Oh well, yes. That would work. Then we could see what might happen.

Ok, see you there!

Not if I see you first hon!

[Masane]

Kay, the ONLY reason I accepted it was BECAUSE HE LIED OOC. but whatever im cool with it either way. Dont even say anything else directed to me because im not reading this anymore. I can wait for kage and if its not voided, yay! If so, oh well.

[Warren]

Not gonna go into the whole metagame/lies/etc part.

However I did say earlier he was wrong to post like your capture was certain, so if you have some way of possibly avoiding the sealing then you're by all means free to attempt it.

[KayentaMoenkopi]

I am confused why if everyone in the rp wants to continue what the issue is then.

[Rusaku]

I guess you should have been more strict in the rp rules, not just when they benefit you.

metagaming is not right. But you permitted and agreed to it being fine. I can't tell you how many RP's I have had to go round and round to even establish certain details before I could finally get to the part of the RP i wanted to do first.

It's like, hey Joe come help me with this.

Uhm, Em, I can't cause we dont' know each other.

Oh geesh...well...what other reason could there be to get us together?

Hrm, nothing? Suna sucks and I never go there?

But...what if I was visiting my daughter in Ame and we bumped into each other?

Oh well, yes. That would work. Then we could see what might happen.

Ok, see you there!

Not if I see you first hon!

This is literally me with all of my friends xD I'm glad I'm not the only one. That's kinda awesome to read, thank you.

But yeah, Masane like I said in PM, no one can void your RP for you. Yes Kage is the the..Kage, but he can't say that RP is void just because he owns the plot of land that the RP is happening on. If you yourself think you can stop this, then do it. We will discuss how you evaded it, should the need arise, but in the meantime if you don't void the RP then this topic has no point other than to put into into the eye of the public.

As it stands I feel as if majority vote has come to the conclusion that claiming Metagame wont really work here considering you accepted the RP. While I understand that you only accepted it because he lied, does not change the fact you accepted it wholeheartedly. Literally told him where your house was within the first post. (Or second, Idk)

Because this is a game, and not actually naruto, we have that additional "make or break" variable known as OOC. If we were 100% honest with every intention, then it would be impossible to get the jump on someone. I feel as if someone has noted this before by calling it "Soft Metagaming" Where people avoid certain situations because they know what will happen IC. Like if Yujo had said that he planned to attack both of them before even coming to ame, then the twins would have acted totally different than when he had lied. Or, as a hypothetical, someone avoiding the use of Wind against a Fire user despite not knowing Ic they use fire. Small things like that.

So while there is some level of injustice with his mendaciousness,  I would have to say it's not quite valid enough to warrant a scapping of his efforts. 

[Murciélago/Bryantheexiled]

Pshh I'm confused on how she's gonna just suddenly realize the whole jutsu is a sham when she hasn't earlier and how shes going to go from totally trusting you to WOAH theres totally something fishy going on here let me stop these seals from sucking me up  when a second ago I thought thus was normal

[Hitler-Chan]

Now.

My original objection was two fold. And basically undecided.
1] Why be fine with Yujo doing the unsealing, saying Ichi's souls was split, and part being in the Edo body while the rest was in Hell, the Shinigam's belly, up unto the point when he backstabs? With their extensive knowledge of Edo Tensei and such, it should have been objected to right there. But no, they still thought he was doing them a favor and so no peeps were made. So they are kind of stuck with it.

On the other hand...

2] Since he did it wrong, character controlling the soul issue with Ichi, then why should they have to stick with that outcome.

HOWEVER

IF...Yujo was in fact not just making claims about Ichi's soul being split and in Hell, the Shinigami's belly...but was just blowing smoke at Masane and Ichi and waving flash mirrors around to fool them into thinking he was helping them...then bravo! Basically, he flaunts her very own jutsu in front of her, doing it wrong on purpose, with great side-show flare, and her character does not go wtf??? I say the RP is not voidable and must continue with the next person's turn.

As to the auto-hit of the sucking Masane into his seal. you do not have to void the rp to take care of that. Her next post merely counters his desired outcome with her action and what really is happening next.

As to the lying about the whole thing, OOC to the players and IC to their characters, that is what ninja do. We used to do it all the time in the clan wars, it is called subterfuge.

The question we have to ask though is this; If Yujo had stated that it "Could" have been Ichirou's soul as opposed to it "was" Ichirou's soul, would the outcome of this RP changed one bit? No, it would not have. With either choice I believe they would have continued with the RP no questions asked just like before and the sealing attempt would have occurred nonetheless. So to try and void the RP based on details that were misconstrued but in the end would have had zero affect on the outcome of the RP itself is just kinda silly to me.

There are many roads we can travel down that would explain why these two are in fact dead, and the Rp cannot be voided, but I will stick with just two.

The first being, they are trying to void and argue details that not only did they accept during the time of the RP, but are arguing them ONLY because they know it is their only way out, not that they know what the deal is.

The second being, that I indeed as Kayenta, and Rusaku and everyone who has read this RP and topic, I simply took these two on a show through the mystical world known as Ninja Magic. They were given so many opportunities to refute or argue things during the time, so many clues and hints that I placed before them, but not ever did they until it became an issue for them.

@ Warren, I didn't post as if she was sealed instantly, "Within the time span of less than 2 seconds would Masane find herself sucked inside of the inscriptions that made up the tattoos on his arm, and forever trapped within them. Considering the amount of trust she had in Yujo, one could doubt that there was much reaction to be had from her, which would make trust the factor that would seal their fate."

If she can do something that isn't a load of BS, I welcomed the Idea, but Kage jumped to the Void Wagon, but if she does make a post of straight meta-gaming nonsense, I will post it here and we will discuss the situation.

[Hitler-Chan]

Pshh I'm confused on how she's gonna just suddenly realize the whole jutsu is a sham when she hasn't earlier and how shes going to go from totally trusting you to WOAH theres totally something fishy going on here let me stop these seals from sucking me up  when a second ago I thought thus was normal

This...^

SOOOOO HARD.

[Warren]

Okay so Masane gets to post her counter, and that's that, no need for further word war.

If she does good then this topic can be locked and forgotten, if not then what to do next can be discussed here again at such a time.

[Hitler-Chan]

Okay so Masane gets to post her counter, and that's that, no need for further word war.

If she does good then this topic can be locked and forgotten, if not then what to do next can be discussed here again at such a time.

I'll lock it till then.

[Kage]

I think it's pretty unfair to rush to this within a span of four hours, without asking me for my thoughts or side. This is why I'm unlocking it with my authority. A fair discussion allows the speaking of all parties involved. A circlejerk only allows and glorifies the opinion of one side.

Here's what irks me about the RP. Yujo takes liberties in adjusting the lore to his own needs so he can use an OP revival technique that outmatches Edo Tensei and Rinne Tensei. It doesn't matter if the excuse for doing so was "smoke and mirrors", but the fact is that he RPed that means he clearly claims to have did it.

Below is the reworking of the lore.

(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō looked back at Masane briefly and spoke out through his mask, "Do you mind bringing the body over to me, souls aren't the most, sturdy things." As he said this, he brought the knife upon himself, just about at his bellybutton, and driving it towards the right. The blade sliced through his (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) flesh, and as this occurred, Masane and Ichirou would be allowed to see the Shinigami for the first time. It's ethereal visage cast itself over Yujo, mimicking his actions as his own blade tore open his gut, "What matter of madness is this?! You Uzumaki and that damned mask." (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) The shinigami spoke out, furious as a few souls were inadvertently released from him and flew off, then a bright blue soul flew forth from the Shinigami, this one was by no doubt, Ichirou's. Yujo, now in control of the Shinigami, reached forward and captured the soul in his ghastly hands (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C), holding it tightly so as to not allow Ichirou's severed soul to pass on. Assuming Masane had brought him Ichirou's body, Yujo would have the Shinigami slam down the Soul back into the corpses chest, and completing the first portion of this ritual. Once done, he looked back at the two (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) and spoke out with a bit of urgency, obviously in quite a bit of pain from the large wound he had inflicted upon himself, "The last bit of Ichirou's soul resides within that Zombie body you reanimated him in, and there are two ways of going about this. I reach inside of it with that (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) guys hand and pull it out, or you release the Edo jutsu on him, and when his soul tries to ascend once again, I'll use that guy to put it back in it's place. The choice is yours, but make it quick." He obviously began to fatigue, using a jutsu like this for extended periods (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) put a strain on anyone, luckily he was used to this kind of jutsu so he had a bit more time than most, but not much."

When really, it's like this.

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Pure_land

The Pure Land (浄土, Jōdo, Viz: Afterworld) is the afterlife in which the souls of earthly beings generally reside in death. Souls that have been sealed, such as by the Dead Demon Consuming Seal, cannot enter the Pure Land until the seal has been released. Furthermore, only those souls that reside in the Pure Land can be reincarnated with the Summoning: Impure World Reincarnation, although they will have no memory of their time in the Pure Land.

So let's shorten this down. Yujo explicitly claims and RPs that a part of Ichirou's soul is in Shinigami's stomach, and because of that, he cannot be revived. This puts a huge hamper on anybody who is dead or an Edo Tensei, because it gives him a whole new world to explore of having access to anybody's and everybody's soul who is dead. Either that, or he claims to be able to pull souls out through the Pure Land via Shinigami's stomach, which also opens up a can of worms in the lore too. But it doesn't work like that. The fact that Ichirou is Edo Tensei'd, means that his soul cannot have possibly been inside of Shinigami's stomach. The only way that could happen, is if he was Dead Demon Consuming Sealed. When he clearly wasn't, because if memory serves correct, he died from having the Four Tails extracted from him.


Here's where I point out the revival methods.

(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō looked back at Masane briefly and spoke out through his mask, "Do you mind bringing the body over to me, souls aren't the most, sturdy things." As he said this, he brought the knife upon himself, just about at his bellybutton, and driving it towards the right. The blade sliced through his (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) flesh, and as this occurred, Masane and Ichirou would be allowed to see the Shinigami for the first time. It's ethereal visage cast itself over Yujo, mimicking his actions as his own blade tore open his gut, "What matter of madness is this?! You Uzumaki and that damned mask." (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) The shinigami spoke out, furious as a few souls were inadvertently released from him and flew off, then a bright blue soul flew forth from the Shinigami, this one was by no doubt, Ichirou's. Yujo, now in control of the Shinigami, reached forward and captured the soul in his ghastly hands (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C), holding it tightly so as to not allow Ichirou's severed soul to pass on. Assuming Masane had brought him Ichirou's body, Yujo would have the Shinigami slam down the Soul back into the corpses chest, and completing the first portion of this ritual. Once done, he looked back at the two (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) and spoke out with a bit of urgency, obviously in quite a bit of pain from the large wound he had inflicted upon himself, "The last bit of Ichirou's soul resides within that Zombie body you reanimated him in, and there are two ways of going about this. I reach inside of it with that (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) guys hand and pull it out, or you release the Edo jutsu on him, and when his soul tries to ascend once again, I'll use that guy to put it back in it's place. The choice is yours, but make it quick." He obviously began to fatigue, using a jutsu like this for extended periods (C)
(2d22h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) put a strain on anyone, luckily he was used to this kind of jutsu so he had a bit more time than most, but not much."
(2d22h) <||||> Uchiha 爆弾 Masane She did indeed bring him the body. As he inflicted the wound upon hi, self, Masane held back her shock. The girl was not expecting this to be a part of the project. Hell she did not no what to expect. She wasted no time in releasi in g the jutsu. ( c )
(2d22h) <||||> Uchiha 爆弾 Masane Her hands moved in a blur to complete the necessary hand seals. Before completeing the set, she looked to her brother and nodded. With that the jutsu would be released and hopefully they would both live through this ordeal
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō took a few deep breaths as he watched Masane release the jutsu, this not being the first time he had seen the Edo tensei jutsu at work, then in unison as the soul of Ichirou was released from the Renanimated body, both Yujo and the Shinigami swung out and grabbed the soul. (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) Once again the Shinigami's hand slammed down onto the chest of Ichirou's corpse, and reunited the two soul parts. With this done, he removed the mask from his face and allowed the Shinigami to fade back to his world. Yujo panted a bit, and turned to face Masane, "Alright, now that his (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) soul is intact, we can begin bringing his body back to life, which will be made much easier since you preserved it for this very reason, I appreciate it." The wound on his abdomen began opening up further, allowing a beating heart to be removed from it. Once it was out, he spoke out (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C)"The life force within this heart will be used as the catalyst to bring him back, though I don't believe it will be enough considering it is just a heart. That is where you come in, Masane." He bent down onto one knee, as he did so, several threads pierced the chest of the corpse before (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) him, latching onto the heart within. Now connected he began funneling the life force from the extracted heart, directly into Ichirou's dead one. With a look back at Masane, he made a motion with his head that now was the time for her help. With labored movement he extended his hand to (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) the woman, giving her access to enter this chain of life, so her chakra could be funneled into Yujo's extracted heart, and eventually into Ichirou, once it's life force had run out. As this happened, a blue aura began to envelop Ichirou's corpse, a visual effect of the jutsu he was (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) performing on her brother. "Quickly now, this isn't exactly the most fun jutsu to use. Imagine opening 7 of the 8 gates, and running a marathon, that's how this feels." He said with a bit of a chuckle, his pain and fatigue being easily dealt with due to his incredibly durable (C)
(2d1h) <||||> 預言者, Uzumaki Yūjō (C) body.

So the entire method of this revival technique is as follows:
- Take out a part of the person's soul from Shinigami's stomach
- Slap that into the body
- Take whatever other pieces there might be at that point, with the claims of being able to rip a soul out from Edo Tensei
- Slap that into the body too
- Pump one's life force into the body to revive them

The above violates the lore, claims on the One's Own Life Reincarnation, and the OP-ness of being able to circumvent revival from canon methods.

After explaining the above to Ichirou and Masane, they understood why it had to be voided. I had to void it because I will not endorse any sort of lore-adjusting that gives a small group of people access to anybody's soul, partial or whole, that can then be manipulated to their desires via custom methods that are only allowed through this lore-twisting. Only a small number of canon techniques allow somebody to call forth a soul from the Pure Land. And the only other person who can just up and summon a soul from the Pure Land without the aid of a disadvantageous or dangerous technique was Hagoromo Otsutsuki.


I don't treat my village members as dogs and command their every move. I let them do as they please on their off-time. But I did have to step in and advise them of why this isn't going to work. By letting this fly, I would be acknowledging and allowing Yujo's claims of being able to do all this. And as a kage of the land, that grants him some privileges and support in the powers he displayed. This is why I void it. Yujo may have claimed that he did it as "smoke and mirrors" to win them over, but RP is RP. He gave no indication whatsoever of this being an illusion.

Once again, I voided this based upon the fact that I cannot accept the twisting of lore and usage of this custom revival technique that utilizes an already-claimed technique and has more advantages to it than disadvantages overall.

And I would advise anybody that locking a topic without letting all parties involved in a situation explain their side is equivalent to circlejerking and defamation/libel. Any topic that I see that is doing this will be unlocked to allow all parties involved to present their case.