Shinobi Legends Forum
Roleplay => Village Square => Topic started by: Camel on October 18, 2016, 01:39:19 AM
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I spoke with a few fellow players and few of the gamemasters about a similarity that I've seen in the recent bijuu fights. Now I am not 'putting anyone on blast' but this type of behavior is something that I cannot condone, since all of us went through a fair process in order to gain a chance at earning a bijou; wanting a bijuu that bad doesn't constitute to deliberately breaking the rules that we set as a community.
"Who? What are talking about Camel?"
I am talking about a fellow player that I happen to caught with an alternate account trying to either secure a bijuu through illegitimate means or make it so if one characters loses, they have a back-up. Which isn't cool and real scummy in this case.
Now you're asking, "Who are you talking about? And stop with the suspense, man!"
Sorry about this. Like I said before, I am not trying to put anyone on blast; I just want an explanation for these actions and want to know why no one spoke up before.
Terumi Dato. I actually caught you registering for the bijuu fights under an alternate account. I wouldn't been able to catch this, had I not misclicked your IP during the validation process of Yuki Zera. Now I don't know if this was you or someone else that you happen to introduce to this game and they decided to register an forum account, while they were at your house. I just don't know. Believe me, man. I'll gladly drop this, if an explanation is given.
What I do know is this isn't the only instance. I spoke with Shadow and we had a suspicion that maybe someone else was doing this too. Arashi Nanashi was someone that I was initially suspicious of, and so was Shadow. I can't be drawing conclusion based on gut feeling alone, so if this is your account. I actually did an investigation and I found out that both me and Shadow were right all along. If you can give me an explanation to why this was condone and I'll drop my suspicions, along with Shadow. This is totally not cool at all, considering that we agreed upon no alternate accounts. I just want an explanation for this behavior that I happen to catch.
"Don't you have alternate accounts, Camel? What if you're doing this to cover your tracks, huh?!"
My alternate accounts are pretty much well-known, if you ever see me editing a character that you haven't seen before; then that happens to be my account that I use. If asked, I'll gladly list which character that I have that is active and which is collecting dust. (I may sell you that dusty account, if the offer is good.)
Now I ask only this, please no flaming or hate-mongering. I simply want a discussion and/or explanation about how this issue can be prevented and also spotted in the future.
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Sorry about this. Like I said before, I am not trying to put anyone on blast; I just want an explanation for these actions and want to know why no one spoke up before...
Possibly because nobody else knew is why no one spoke up before. I mean, you had to go through IP's in order to make a suspicion a little bit more than that. I personally think talking to the people in PM's to try to clear things first would have been the best option, and then if you didn't believe them or whatever, we get to this point.
Other than recognizing zoning and RPing styles (which can be quite hard) there is not much of a way of identifying alternate accounts by more than hunch or suspicion without special privelages, unless someone knows that the alt is an alt and comes forward (which may have been the audience you meant when you wondered why this hadn't come up before).
And technically, we agreed that players can only challenge for one beast, we never said that the challenger couldn't be the alt. Now how you found out about the not so conventional underhanded stuff is up to the imagination I guess, but I do have to ask, does this revelation affect any of the current biju awards/matches? I ask that question as a Biju Council Member.
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Sorry about this. Like I said before, I am not trying to put anyone on blast; I just want an explanation for these actions and want to know why no one spoke up before...
Possibly because nobody else knew is why no one spoke up before. I mean, you had to go through IP's in order to make a suspicion a little bit more than that. I personally think talking to the people in PM's to try to clear things first would have been the best option, and then if you didn't believe them or whatever, we get to this point.
Other than recognizing zoning and RPing styles (which can be quite hard) there is not much of a way of identifying alternate accounts by more than hunch or suspicion without special privelages, unless someone knows that the alt is an alt and comes forward (which may have been the audience you meant when you wondered why this hadn't come up before).
And technically, we agreed that players can only challenge for one beast, we never said that the challenger couldn't be the alt. Now how you found out about the not so conventional underhanded stuff is up to the imagination I guess, but I do have to ask, does this revelation affect any of the current biju awards/matches? I ask that question as a Biju Council Member.
It affects the Sanbi, and maybe one other, pending if Nanashi's alt won a biju. If the claims turn out to be true, the council could decide to strip the Sanbi and maybe another beast. Not because using an alt won them said beast, but because they broke the rules. Up to you guys if the charges are accurate.
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Didn't we go through an IP verification process when we had votes on a specific thing awhile back? I don't remember on what it was. Something bijuu related...so there wasn't 4 votes from one person.
I was going to bring up my suspicion of Nanashi being an alt to the powers that be, but thought against it. For those of you who I talked to I knew Nanashi was an alt I just couldn't pinpoint as to who. For the most part I just wanted my curiosity killed.
-------------------------Topic relevant-
I personally think we shouldn't have to IP track in instances like this, cause at the end of the day I don't really care if someone has 23 bijuu. (That's not to say that you dropped out and wasted my time) But to those that are more inclined to a fair field of play I can see your point of view as well. So while I'm IDC if it was put in as mandatory I wouldn't mind IP cross-checking.
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And technically, we agreed that players can only challenge for one beast, we never said that the challenger couldn't be the alt. Now how you found out about the not so conventional underhanded stuff is up to the imagination I guess, but I do have to ask, does this revelation affect any of the current biju awards/matches? I ask that question as a Biju Council Member.
I never said that players were barred from using their alternate accounts to challenge for bijuu. What I don't like is players registering for a bijuu fight with an account they specify, but secretly registered for another fight under a different persona. You have two accounts at this point registering for two separate bijuu fights.
Now does this disqualify anyone or strip anyone of any bijuu they won? I don't know. I am not bijuu council and this is a matter, if serious enough; I assume it will be spoken between all of the council.
Tobias/Vail won his match fairly and didn't break any rules. I can't say for the others, because I don't know if maybe they had a sibling or a significant other play on their internet, which will explain the similarities between accounts.
However since we are already so far into these matches, I won't call for a strip. Instead I want an explanation on why this was done and what were *you* planning to get out it anyway. If these player wanted a bijuu that bad, other routes could've been taken. These players could've waited until everything was distributed then attempt to get the bijuu of your choice, but then again patience is somewhat of a virtue on here.
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Pending a good explanation. I think said fighters should be stripped/ dq'd. If you were dishonest in getting the biju, you can't be trusted to keep it and follow other rules in my opinion. But it's not up to me.
But as Camel says, we should wait for an explanation. No need to start a witch hunt just yet.
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Pending a good explanation. I think said fighters should be stripped/ dq'd. If you were dishonest in getting the biju, you can't be trusted to keep it and follow other rules in my opinion. But it's not up to me.
But as Camel says, we should wait for an explanation. No need to start a witch hunt just yet.
Is basically foaming at the mouth.
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(http://i.imgur.com/aa7EjUO.gif)
Yeah, I'm Nanashi. I don't feel like waiting to be outed, or for some kind IP witch hunter to happen. I know a bunch of people already guessed it was me, and I mean c'mon, who starts off good at this site?
Want an explanation? Uhh, I didn't like the reputation I had when I was Rusaku/Ryoji, and wanted to see how things would differ if I was someone else. Guess what? Most of you treated me very differently. Though that is not at all the point here. I wanted a stress free environment to play my decade old hobby, and I got exactly that. Now here I am, with red ass hands. The only reason I brought Ryoji back at all was because I saw the influx of people who joined back after Bocc was banned. Figured he was one of my biggest complaints, and I could enjoy the game that much more with him gone and my first character back in action.
The only consolation I have for you is that I pulled Nanashi from the Shadow fight because I didn't feel like being a cheater.
My reasons for doing it had nothing to do with cheating the system and getting Biju, but so I could enjoy this game without stigma. I have a feeling it was the same for Dart. I mean look at how we have strung out Kiri and everyone associated with it. He probably just wanted to play the game again without being poo poo'ed on for just being Dart. Then when he found out no one was doing that on his main, he dropped Zera. This is just speculation of course, but whatever.
Am I sorry? Not really, I had a good time doing it all. Should I be D'Q'ed? Obviously I'm gonna say no. I still won my fight, and trying to win the current one, but I dropped the alt out of the race so I wasn't being a cheater. If you wanna punish me for that then I don't honestly know what to say xD.
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Am I sorry? Not really...
Well, I think I know where I stand on this issue:
~ Kneejerk Gif, check.
~ Proclamation of innocennce intent, check.
~ Confession to entry coupled with correction of rule-breaking act, check.
~ Unapologetic conclusion without a hint of understanding of the actual problem, check.
You don't think you should be DQ'd for messing with the system? Now what kind of example would that set for future events like this? I don't know about the others but if you don't get that the violation of the principle behind the ban in the first place is the problem and not the ultimate outcome of the violation, then I don't know what else to say other than:
From my current point of view, good intentions pretty much always lead to bad outcomes when the "greater good" is achieved with the "lesser evil".
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Zera Yuki was an account used by current fling. Well, I guess ex-fling now that she ended it. That would be why she's been inactive. Trying to wrestle back for control of the account as we speak so I can keep the character alive because I helped shaped the character. Did I play it for RP? No, I logged on to level it and show her how to level it. She decided to enter the bijū contest on her own, against my strong aversion, for this very same lame speculation.
Did I try to cheat the system? Hell no! Eff that. My honor is one of the only things I got left in this world and I sure as hell ain't going to have my integrity questioned and blasphemed without even being asked what that situation was. Kamui, I thought I knew you better than that.
All I was simply just trying to do is get another dorky person into SL and what I like so I could have someone to talk to about the happenings within this realm I so vastly enjoy. If I am going to get crucifed for that, then that's some straight up bs
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On that note I'm out of this topic. My curiosity was sated and as said I don't care enough to get my pitchfork. There's usually a lot of ad hominem in topics, especially the ones that call people out.
:orcpoursuite:
Have fun all. :roll:
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On that note I'm out of this topic. My curiosity was sated and as said I don't care enough to get my pitchfork. There's usually a lot of ad hominem in topics, especially the ones that call people out.
:orcpoursuite:
Have fun all. :roll:
This.
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All I was simply just trying to do is get another dorky person into SL and what I like so I could have someone to talk to about the happenings within this realm I so vastly enjoy. If I am going to get crucifed for that, then that's some straight up bs
Well, there is the burial option.
Just kidding. I find this scenario a little more forgivable, I mean, you didn't intentionally break the one challenge per player rule. Truth be told it can be said that you didn't break it at all, except to my knowledge your word is pretty much the only thing we have to go on here.
It feels weird advocating for punishing Rusaku for the prinicple and then advocating for letting Dato off because of an explanation that his now ex-fling maybe gone friendzone hopped onto the account and entered the match of her own volition.
I mean, Dato, why not say something sooner just to cover yourself? You've been here awhile, you know how these things go, why leave it to chance? I understand none of us can think of everything, but it seems that her going on without telling you bothered you at least somewhat before this point.
I guess staying on my soapbox without other folks' commentary on this matter is a waste of good wood, as my usual "baby with the bathwater to control disease" approach really conflicts with my sense of fairness here. And that's a really weird thing for me.
Of course, if nothing new is going to be added to the thread, then I guess bringing up a Biju Council discussion would be the most logical course of action. See how that goes.
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All I was simply just trying to do is get another dorky person into SL and what I like so I could have someone to talk to about the happenings within this realm I so vastly enjoy. If I am going to get crucifed for that, then that's some straight up bs
I mean, Dato, why not say something sooner just to cover yourself? You've been here awhile, you know how these things go, why leave it to chance? I understand none of us can think of everything, but it seems that her going on without telling you bothered you at least somewhat before this point.
I guess staying on my soapbox without other folks' commentary on this matter is a waste of good wood, as my usual "baby with the bathwater to control disease" approach really conflicts with my sense of fairness here. And that's a really weird thing for me.
Of course, if nothing new is going to be added to the thread, then I guess bringing up a Biju Council discussion would be the most logical course of action. See how that goes.
I didn't say anything because I thought I would have been asked about it, privately at first, before being sent to the executioner. That thought as well as I didn't want to jeopardize her interactions with the other players (outside of bijū stuff) in case they didn't like that she was associated with me.
But now, I don't care. Will I get a hold of the Zera account? I should, yes, should she finally just tell me the damn password. So will it be mine? Yes, eventually. But did I intentionally enter into the bijū contest with the account? No. I didn't even know she had created a forum account until I saw the sticky topic for the fight.
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I just wanted an explanation to why this was done, both of you provided a explanation for the actions that were taken by you or someone else. (Different player, Same IP.)
I'll repeat myself, I don't want anyone being stripped of their beast or disqualified from their respective bracket. If bijuu council wants to discuss it or bring it up, so that this sort of thing can prevented; that is up to them to decide.
Had this occur with someone participating in a bijuu fight and they picked an alternate account for a judge, you would think that the other party would be somewhat disappointed. If not, downright furious that this occurred and why nothing was done to prevent it. And this situation shouldn't be any different, since the outcome of a bijuu match can be easily decided through either methods.
I could've kept my mouth shut and let this slide, but what would that put me at? Absolutely nowhere. I'll still have the guilt knowing that someone did this and I did nothing to point it out until it was too late.
The way I look at it, if you're responsible enough to have a bijuu or had one in the past, you should know that if a challenger abides by your void list; you should at least abide by the bijuu rules. Shouldn't be that hard, right?
PS: If no one else is going to interject some commentary or give their thought on this issue, I'll go ahead a wrap this thread up by this evening or tomorrow.
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I wasn't going to chime in until after we decided he wasn't going to be stripped (call me old fashion), but I spoke with Dart and Zera while they were on, and while my initial thoughts after hearing the two were probably the same person was blind rage, I then thought back on the conversations and really they seemed like different people. Dart didn't seem like the greedy type when I spoke to him about the Sanbi, it wasn't about coveting these beasts, it was for the advancement and generation of RP for his character.
Of course a blanket "It could have been him lying stoopid~"
Well duh, but I figured if I came about defending his position, the new light some members may see him under will not be of a liar. Do what you will with this information :D
Ps. I bet some of you are real conflicted now, "Man, is he actually an ass, or his he just passionate about a few things." ;D
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"Man, is he actually an ass, or his he just passionate about a few things." ;D
This is me in a nutshell Cx
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"Man, is he actually an ass, or his he just passionate about a few things." ;D
This is me in a nutshell Cx
It's 100% the first one. >> << >>
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"Man, is he actually an ass, or his he just passionate about a few things." ;D
This is me in a nutshell Cx
It's 100% the first one. >> << >>
Senpai pls ;-;
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Disappearing sister and now disappearing GF?
lol
This shit never gets old.
Well...the RP style doesn't lie.
That's about al I got to say on this issue. You guys believe what you want.
As for you trying to get her into the whole SL thing...I checked out her wikia pages...numerous pages...she seems very accomplished in crafting jutsu, setting up pages on the wikia and creating an intricate character here...all since August of this year to be a noob you had to coach on being a narutotard and try to get her into the stuff you enjoy.
and if we are all going to black the eyes of Gitsune and fight tooth and nail to make her provide documented screen shots just to be sure she is not a big fat liar...
well yeah. I will be that person who calls you a liar Dart in that we can't just take your word for it. Its just all too neat for my liking.
I believe there is a section in the site rules about shared IPs. You can't prove that you are two different people. SO in that aspect its all about what you can fast talk someone into believing.
I'm not biting.
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Disappearing sister and now disappearing GF?
lol
This shit never gets old.
Well...the RP style doesn't lie.
That's about al I got to say on this issue. You guys believe what you want.
As for you trying to get her into the whole SL thing...I checked out her wikia pages...numerous pages...she seems very accomplished in crafting jutsu, setting up pages on the wikia and creating an intricate character here...all since August of this year to be a noob you had to coach on being a narutotard and try to get her into the stuff you enjoy.
and if we are all going to black the eyes of Gitsune and fight tooth and nail to make her provide documented screen shots just to be sure she is not a big fat liar...
well yeah. I will be that person who calls you a liar Dart in that we can't just take your word for it. Its just all too neat for my liking.
I believe there is a section in the site rules about shared IPs. You can't prove that you are two different people. SO in that aspect its all about what you can fast talk someone into believing.
I'm not biting.
Sister is still around, she doesn't want to play this game. Especially with the stupid drama (such as this) when it arises.
As for the wikia pages, obviously I helped make those for my fling.(I never said girlfriend.) She didn't know what the hell she was doing with the wikia pages and I like making pages. It worked out nicely that way.
As for being a Narutard, she already liked Naruto way before SL. That's why I suggested getting onto the site to begin with. Duhhhh.
But you're always so obstinate in your beliefs and refuse to accept anyone else's truths unless they are your own, so I'm honestly not surprised that you had something to say or disagree with.
Also, I totally can prove that we are two separate entities since Facebook is a thing.
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Honestly, I don't see the point to even go that far with proving two different people were on the same IP, it isn't important. There are some people who are going to believe you and there are some that aren't, cause it could be a nifty lie and you could have good friends who wouldn't mind lying to a bunch of strangers on the internet o.o which one of those people I am isn't important.
But even if Dart is, or isn't, lying, he claims innocence. While a party has stepped up and confessed to willingly beating the system, unlike Dart.
The question is if either of these men should be punished? And if so, how far? Or do we just ignore that this happened and just move on?
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The question is if either of these men should be punished? And if so, how far? Or do we just ignore that this happened and just move on?
Disqualification or, if already a winner, a stripping. I mean what does it matter that one of the parties is willing to cough up evidence to prove not guilty? As Kay pointed out, we rarely take people's words around here when it comes to stuff, so let's just throw them both under the car.
That last sentnece was sarcasm. Let the man put his pics on the table, what will it hurt? All the more reason for him to get the lesser of the two rods. Otherwise, might as well whack them the same. And DQ them, post facto if necessary.
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pics
Oooohhh pics, you say :oops:
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The question is if either of these men should be punished? And if so, how far? Or do we just ignore that this happened and just move on?
Disqualification or, if already a winner, a stripping. I mean what does it matter that one of the parties is willing to cough up evidence to prove not guilty? As Kay pointed out, we rarely take people's words around here when it comes to stuff, so let's just throw them both under the car.
That last sentnece was sarcasm. Let the man put his pics on the table, what will it hurt? All the more reason for him to get the lesser of the two rods. Otherwise, might as well whack them the same. And DQ them, post facto if necessary.
I don't really see much of an uproar over what happened save for you and Kayenta. There was no harm or foul with either case. Both Shadow and Vail couldn't seem to care less about their opponents being alts, considering both parties quit before anything really happened. No big deal.
And before you go on saying "we don't understand what we did wrong" That's false. I understand perfectly fine, hence me dropping out and not actually cheating. I can't speak for dart if he decides to stick with the fling story.
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While I've been mostly playful about certain things that have been mentioned in the thread, I can't help but agree with Rusaku about the entire situation... well, with his situation... to an extent. While I heard that you understand that you knew of the rules for the alts and whatever, you still went and did the challenge.
Couldn't you have simply challenged Shadow after his grace period was up? Or is the no alts rules pertain to the entirety of the SL realm? If that's the case, it's rather odd. If a single person can basically control all nine, why can't an alt, that's already been established in the IC/SL world, go for a beast.
Granted I'm just diving in with no knowledge to how shallow/deep this rabbit hole might be, but if that's the case, one can simply cap it to two an owner if they choose to go that route. Because, like I said, if somebody can have all nine, why should it matter if the alt challenges for one while the main is doing the same?
In the case of the whole dropping out thing, since (in my opinion) Zera had basically lost already by the time this was brought to Camel's attention. I'm not being biased in my opinion of the outcome, but it seemed pretty straightforward to me. I haven't read Shadow's fight with Nanashi, so I can't really give an opinion on that when the latter dropped out. But, since it was not a bracket tournament, I believe the Shadow should at least fight the Biju to subdue it. It could be full power or weakened due to the fight that happened beforehand, if that even makes sense. I could say the same about Tobias. Obviously, both shouldn't have a problem considering who they are. But that decision would have to be up to the Biju Council, just to figure out if enough fighting was done before the dropping. That's just my two cents for the day... maybe for a few days.
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So let me get this straight, Jay... Instead of punishing either of the people that broke the rules, whether it being willingly or not... You want to punish Shadow and Tobi because their opponents are at fault? O.o I hope you don't mind me saying this, but that's kinda silly.
It had been stated countless times, and asked about then answered, that there were to be no double entries. And yet, here we are, where rules were broken and nothing is going to be done about it >> Not too shocked about that part.
But I'd rather there be no 'justice' delivered on this case rather than having two people who did nothing wrong be stripped of their beasts(both winners having won so at least a week ago) and to fight them again to see if they can win. Like you said, they shouldn't have a problem actually winning the beast, but they didn't do anything to have to deserve that O.O
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So let me get this straight, Jay... Instead of punishing either of the people that broke the rules, whether it being willingly or not... You want to punish Shadow and Tobi because their opponents are at fault? O.o I hope you don't mind me saying this, but that's kinda silly.
It had been stated countless times, and asked about then answered, that there were to be no double entries. And yet, here we are, where rules were broken and nothing is going to be done about it >> Not too shocked about that part.
But I'd rather there be no 'justice' delivered on this case rather than having two people who did nothing wrong be stripped of their beasts(both winners having won so at least a week ago) and to fight them again to see if they can win. Like you said, they shouldn't have a problem actually winning the beast, but they didn't do anything to have to deserve that O.O
I admit I was super tired when I wrote the post and my thoughts drifted to basically just writing whatever popped into my mind, but I wasn't leaning towards them losing the beast they already contended for. I just want to see how strong they are against a beast. It's all tied into my personal little test of strength, in which I wanted to fight all nine of them while a certain immortal was holding the reigns. So yeah, I want them to fight the beasts, but it's only for sh*ts and giggles, just to have something to do really. Hell I want to see everybody fight the tailed beasts. They're supposed to be the pinnacle of power, so of course with the perfect GM handling the beast, the bout will be intense as well as interesting. But if nobody wants the RP, I'll just stay out of discussions like I have been.
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Even though I don't condone the actions done by either party, there is nothing I can do that can make all of this right. If any actions are taken at this point, we will be set back in the redistribution process by a week or so.
I'm pretty sure it would've be more outrageous had this been a judge caught being in act of being someone's alternate. We can't have someone deciding the battle before it already occurred, which could be done through either methods.
If this happens again in the future, you bet your a** I will speak up on it and will go through the necessary steps to ensue that someone gets punished for it. I have to draw the line somewhere and say, "Hey! This isn't fair for the rest of us."
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I have done nothing wrong and I firmly stand by that.
However, because this is such a heated topic and no one is having fun with any of these ideas, I will simply abdicate my claim to the Sanbi and am willingly giving it back to the council so they can do with what they will.
I am not going to sit here and have mud slung at my honor and integrity nor am I selfish enough to keep the beast when the decision is not unanimous by the members of this society.
If I want the beasts, ever, then I will come for them at a later date to the appropriate parties. They are just a RP generating tool in a game. They are not that important to be slandered and mocked.
So again, I reiterate, I deny any wrongdoing but still I relinquish the Sanbi back to the Council.
Good day and lock this damn thread already.
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I have done nothing wrong and I firmly stand by that.
However, because this is such a heated topic and no one is having fun with any of these ideas, I will simply abdicate my claim to the Sanbi and am willingly giving it back to the council so they can do with what they will.
I am not going to sit here and have mud slung at my honor and integrity nor am I selfish enough to keep the beast when the decision is not unanimous by the members of this society.
If I want the beasts, ever, then I will come for them at a later date to the appropriate parties. They are just a RP generating tool in a game. They are not that important to be slandered and mocked.
So again, I reiterate, I deny any wrongdoing but still I relinquish the Sanbi back to the Council.
Good day and lock this damn thread already.
Look. I had a feeling that if I made this thread, one of two things would happen. One, is that someone would relinquish their beast for whatever reason. Two, is that we would get pass this issue and learn from our mistakes, no harm no foul.
No one is slandering anyone. Kayenta is the only one who is calling you a liar, which I previously stated in my posts to not start something. Shame on her for being passionate enough to voice her opinion, but blatantly miss where I said no fighting or slandering; never let emotions get in the way of your opinion. It could've been a mistake on her part, I don't know nor am I going to press the issue with her.
However if you feel that you're not responsible enough for Sanbi, then go ahead a say it rather than give it up due to 'slandering' and 'mocking' from the person who is mocking you. Would help if you point out all of this, rather than tell me to lock the thread.
At this point, I feel that if you gave up Sanbi due to these reason *you* stated. Then I will be under the impression, along with the others is that you were not responsible enough for that said bijuu.
I'll repeat myself for the fourth-fifth time. I am not calling for a strip nor has anyone called for strip on this thread. Athos and Eric suggested that the council tackle the issue, but I want to put all of this behind us and prevent something like this from occurring in the future.
Dato. If you're adamant on giving back the beast, so be it. That decision alone will set us back a week on the whole redistribution process, so you won't have to worry about burdening the weight; the council will have to burden this weight and go through the process of selecting another suitable host.
PS: I was going to lock this thread yesterday, but more commentary was added to the discussion.
PPS: If I sounded like a jerk in my statement, I sincerely apologize in advance for my serious demeanor.
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I really don't see why Dart is giving back the Sanbi. There's no reason for it.
Rusaku has openly admitted to having an alt in while Dart affirms Zera not being him. We can't prove otherwise so at the base are we really going with 'Guilty until proven innocent'? Thought it was the other way around. Dart is innocent. Even if he is lying it doesn't seem like anyone cares.
I still talk to Bocc and he knew/wanted this to happen. Have everyone be in a big hissy over the bijuu by giving them to the council. Even with him being gone Bocc is still fucking with you. Congrats.
I don't care, Tobias I doubt cares since he hasn't even replied to this topic at all except to +1 my comment about not caring. I'd say it's time to drop it.
To the suggestions made by others:
No.
In the future just IP check everyone. No duplicate IP. And yes I'm suggesting no punishment. "Oh but they broke the rules!" Tobias and I - The two affected DGAF. Move on.
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It's a well known fact that Rusaku and I are friends (Or the same person depending on where you are standing xD) and even saying this I am so very confused as to why this topic was made and talked about at all if everyone is too afraid of the word punishment to even begin dealing with it's possibility.
Of course I don't want to see my friend punished but this whole thing is becoming a huge waste of time. Imagine the Salem witch hunts done exclusively by Ghandi. That image while hilarious is what I'm seeing here and to keep you all from going insane, make a god damned decision already and let these people rest. If you aren't going to punish anyone, lock it now, otherwise quit the pussyfooting and bring down the hammer.
Let me help you out.
LOCK THREAD
Cause I know you all ;P
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Disagree with some here, in fact, I agree with Kay. If it were up to me, I'd strip/ dq them.
Anyway, let the council make a thread and decide, not need for the peanut gallery too. However, I have some suggestions.
1. If the duo are stripped, Athos gets the Kyuubi or fights Madara for it. Dato's foe gets the Sanbi, a chance to fight it, or it gets redistributed with the Mazo.
2. All or nothing policy. If you punish Rus, you have to punish Dato. If you spare Dato, you have to spare Rus.
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Look. I had a feeling that if I made this thread, one of two things would happen. One, is that someone would relinquish their beast for whatever reason. Two, is that we would get pass this issue and learn from our mistakes, no harm no foul...
What?
So let me get this straight. You made this thread to effectively accomplish nothing? To put it into perspective, you bring an issue regarding the alternate rules to the public and did not expect some sort of action to be taken if one or both parties were found to be guilty?
That doesn't make any sense, at least not to me. Let me explain why in brief:
... It had been stated countless times, and asked about then answered, that there were to be no double entries. And yet, here we are, where rules were broken and nothing is going to be done about it >> Not too shocked about that part...
I don't really see much of an uproar over what happened save for you and Kayenta...
Someone missed the fact that neither Kayenta nor I created this topic in the first place, and had the thread not been, we would have neither known or really cared too much about the fights. And I for one, being a member of the Biju Council, do not want a "lack of rule enforcement", our only real job for the time being, to be a predictable pattern. To my understanding, it was our job act on rule violations brought to our attention, regardless of the source. Which brings me to my next comment:
...I still talk to Bocc and he knew/wanted this to happen. Have everyone be in a big hissy over the bijuu by giving them to the council. Even with him being gone Bocc is still fucking with you. Congrats...
In the future just IP check everyone. No duplicate IP. And yes I'm suggesting no punishment. "Oh but they broke the rules!" Tobias and I - The two affected DGAF. Move on.
The main point was that the rule was broken, not the end result, which the opponents not caring upon finding out is a part of.
Oh, and for the record, you are real late on that "Bocc still screwing with yall" bit, since Bocc had his ha-ha the moment the Council decided to actually accept the accursed beasts in the first place and redistribute them. Correct me if I am wrong, but I do not recall you putting that bit of obvious manipulation in its place at all; now that the Council is practically duty-bound to do its job (redistribution was not in the job description) it's all "you played into his hands dummies"?
The way I see it, you should just leave the mic on the podium when you get done with it, as that gesture is just as much a matter of convenience as your position on the issue.
1. If the duo are stripped, Athos gets the Kyuubi or fights Madara for it. Dato's foe gets the Sanbi, a chance to fight it, or it gets redistributed with the Mazo.
Having Athos fight Madara would take a week or two. Just awarding it to him would be easier, but a proper disqualification would put Madara back in the running. x_x
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It's a well known fact that Rusaku and I are friends (Or the same person depending on where you are standing xD) and even saying this I am so very confused as to why this topic was made and talked about at all if everyone is too afraid of the word punishment to even begin dealing with it's possibility.
Of course I don't want to see my friend punished but this whole thing is becoming a huge waste of time. Imagine the Salem witch hunts done exclusively by Ghandi. That image while hilarious is what I'm seeing here and to keep you all from going insane, make a god damned decision already and let these people rest. If you aren't going to punish anyone, lock it now, otherwise quit the pussyfooting and bring down the hammer.
Let me help you out.
LOCK THREAD
Cause I know you all ;P
Square up homie, I'm sick of yo shit >.>;
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It's a well known fact that Rusaku and I are friends (Or the same person depending on where you are standing xD) and even saying this I am so very confused as to why this topic was made and talked about at all if everyone is too afraid of the word punishment to even begin dealing with it's possibility.
Of course I don't want to see my friend punished but this whole thing is becoming a huge waste of time. Imagine the Salem witch hunts done exclusively by Ghandi. That image while hilarious is what I'm seeing here and to keep you all from going insane, make a god damned decision already and let these people rest. If you aren't going to punish anyone, lock it now, otherwise quit the pussyfooting and bring down the hammer.
Let me help you out.
LOCK THREAD
Cause I know you all ;P
Square up homie, I'm sick of yo shit >.>;
I wanna watch that fight \(^_^)/
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So let me get this straight. You made this thread to effectively accomplish nothing? To put it into perspective, you bring an issue regarding the alternate rules to the public and did not expect some sort of action to be taken if one or both parties were found to be guilty?
Look, this wouldn't have been an issue to begin with had I not coincidentally did the cross-checking of IPs. So the way I look at it, I brought up a potential issue that even eludes the eyes of the so called "council".
The rules state that one bijuu per character, but how would you know that some combatants would be true to their word? For me to get involved just proves that I attempted or at least tried to close up this loophole and let bygones be bygones.
Others don't feel comfortable about it or agree with everyone letting it slide. Some feel that Bocchiere is getting the "last laugh", when I couldn't disagree more. I am not trying to incite a witch hunt or anything, but just pointing out the potential to abuse unless IP cross checking is done like Shadow suggested. Which is something that is out of the council's power, unless you want to discuss how you go about this with either me or another staff member that has this power.
If Dato wants to give up Sanbi, that's his choice. I said that I didn't want a strip or anything, only wanted to put this issue up for discussion. But I guess no one listen to what I said here: Now I ask only this, please no flaming or hate-mongering. I simply want a discussion and/or explanation about how this issue can be prevented and also spotted in the future.
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Look. This wouldn't have been an issue to begin with had I not coincidentally did the cross-checking of IPs. So the way I look at it, I brought up a potential issue that even eludes the eyes of the so called "council".
Yeah, and since you brought it up, it's the Council's job to act on it or at least discuss it, especially if there is sufficient cause to believe that rule violations occurred.
... I am not trying to incite a witch hunt or anything, but just pointing out the potential to abuse unless IP cross checking is done like Shadow suggested...
To my knowledge, here on the forum, Ace and You are the only one who can IP-cross check. Asking you two to scan every fight on the forum, in a situation like this, I feel, is overkill. Similar to the "cheating" bits in every iteration of the biju rules since they got formalized being mostly post-facto. On SL proper, to my knowledge (which is limited, I am not staff over there) there is no way to IP-crosscheck or anything of that sort.
Long paragraph short and with some extra, Kayenta talking about RP styles is another possible way, but again, is not 100% reliable.
Someone like you finding out about this and bringing it up is the only way the Council would be able to act on something like this, especially ince we can't go on witchhunts ourselves last I checked.
If Dato wants to give up Sanbi, that's his choice. I said that I didn't want a strip or anything, only wanted to put this issue up for discussion. But I guess no one listen to what I said...
We read it and, if there are those like me out there, didn't really understand it. Because you can ask about a discussion for preventing/explaining how the issue can be prevented and spotted without ousting certain individuals. Had you not done the latter part, I at least would have taken your "I don't want anything done but talk" bit more to heart.
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Bocc' is def. getting the last laugh with the constant squabbles that go on over these mythical beasts. IMO, the only one who used an alt that we can confirm is Rusaku and he even withdrew it. He didn't really do anything wrong as it would have been a different thing had he used it to win two beasts. We cannot confirm if Dart is lying or not so we cannot say that he used an alt or not. In the end, it makes the most sense to continue on with the battles as they have been and for no stripping to take place. That will only further serve to complicate things and spark arguments and disagreements. As Camel said, had he or any other Mod chosen to kept quiet then this matter wouldn't have even been public knowledge.
Camel brought it up and he has called for no stripping. He was merely pointing it out so that this can be prevented in the future by the community.
tl;dr: no stirp; discussion only.
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Lol wow this is getting crazy. I'm on Darts side however. If this wasn't a big deal in the first place, which it wasn't, thenwhy make a thread on it. Dart giving up the Sanbi to avoid being harassed and hated upon since all people from Kiri already are for some reason, does not indicate his ability to actually RP with the beast and handle it. So I don't see how that connects. Also this thread should have been locked years ago >_>
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Yeah well, now there is a member vote on the issue. I imagine it will within a few days put this to bed one way or another, as there haven't been too many undecided posting in this particular thread.
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Yeah well, now there is a member vote on the issue. I imagine it will within a few days put this to bed one way or another, as there haven't been too many undecided posting in this particular thread.
That's what happens when you have an uncompleted roster of council members. No one to complete the tie-breaker, when you have only four members.
Also the only undecided or those are for punishment happen to be you, Chinote, Trev, Kayenta and I think Athos (Not sure on him.)
Everyone else is saying we should let bygones be bygones and move on, but from here on forth we need to watch for IPs that may match with another username. Conflicts in IPs is what brought us here in the first place. (The numbers here outnumber the ones that want punishment. So, yeah. Don't see why it is implied that there is a a lot of undecided votes, when it's only a few that haven't leaned towards punishment or forgiveness.)
I am suggesting what Ace said, and have every member vote by saying their thought in a small post. I know Ace suggested polls, but there option for abuse is out there so it would be best to count each vote individually in the other thread. <- There is a another thread that Eric made specifically for fixing this tie-breaker.
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Yeah well, now there is a member vote on the issue. I imagine it will within a few days put this to bed one way or another, as there haven't been too many undecided posting in this particular thread.
That's what happens when you have an uncompleted roster of council members. No one to complete the tie-breaker, when you have only four members.
Also the only undecided or those are for punishment happen to be you, Chinote, Trev, Kayenta and I think Athos (Not sure on him.)
Everyone else is saying we should let bygones be bygones and move on, but from here on forth we need to watch for IPs that may match with another username. Conflicts in IPs is what brought us here in the first place. (The numbers here outnumber the ones that want punishment. So, yeah. Don't see why it is implied that there is a a lot of undecided votes, when it's only a few that haven't leaned towards punishment or forgiveness.)
I am suggesting what Ace said, and have every member vote by saying their thought in a small post. I know Ace suggested polls, but there option for abuse is out there so it would be best to count each vote individually in the other thread. <- There is a another thread that Eric made specifically for fixing this tie-breaker.
The implication was that there were few undecided among those who cared to post, so it was pretty clear where a member vote was going to go. Hence why I added in the overwhelming majority part and only had the poll run for 4 days; this won't take long to resolve, this I am fairly confident on based on what I've read in this thread.
The only ones who can watch for IP's are you and Ace. You guys actually want that job? Do guidelinse for when that kind of checking is necessary need to be made?
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You guys actually want that job? Do guidelines for when that kind of checking is necessary need to be made?
Excuse me for the late reply, had a part on my computer that I had to replaced but I am back to being active again until something else happens.
If it becomes necessary, me or Ace will be here to do any sort of checking in order to validate that no rules or if any rules were broken.
Question is, are you fine with either me or Ace actually using our powers when council requests information that cannot be normally acquired through social interaction?
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You guys actually want that job? Do guidelines for when that kind of checking is necessary need to be made?
Excuse me for the late reply, had a part on my computer that I had to replaced but I am back to being active again until something else happens.
If it becomes necessary, me or Ace will be here to do any sort of checking in order to validate that no rules or if any rules were broken.
Question is, are you fine with either me or Ace actually using our powers when council requests information that cannot be normally acquired through social interaction?
Me, I'm fine with you guys using those powers whenever; using it as evidence or backing though (such as at the beginning of this thread) I personally would rather you guys do upon request rather than at personal discretion.
That would make an interesting vote topic, though there isn't really much stopping you two from using your powers anyways except personal discretion.