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[Angra Mainyu]

It's literally a page ago Yumei >>

An opinion was made, however there was no decision ruled;

Agreed, this all looks legal and tidy. Can we have one person post the official entirety of what we all agree upon? Essentially that any and all canon items can be challenged for.

Would that include summoning contracts, or fighting for the right to sign one for the canon summons like Toads/Frogs, Slugs, Snakes, etc.?

I would say items and to sign contracts would be fine. That's just my opinion

Edit: Although, does that sit well with everybody else (regarding canon summoning rights)?

[Chika]

I don't see why not. I think Bocc has already took the initiative and begun taking/requesting challenges for items as we speak...

[sploofmoof]

I believe challenging for Canon items is a yes, too many people are inactive that hold them now. 
As for Canon summons, there has been proven to be a contract for people to sign (as shown with Naruto).  BUT, it was the summons that ultimately decided if they would fight for the contract signer.  So ultimately it doesn't make any sense to be able to challenge for the rights to sign it, since the current beasts are loyal to their current signer and if that owner simply tells those summons not to follow the new signer then they would probably listen right?

In the case of special summons like the Mazo, that have no emotions or attachment to the summoner I still think that it should not be possible to challenge for them.  The Mazo is even more complicated than a normal summon (and as Zojin stated it is classified as a personal summon as only one person is shown to be able to summon it at a time since it is just a single summon).  I would say that Mazo could be challenged for if it had a Bijuu in it to keep it's summoner from abusing a potential loophole in the rule.  As well as the knowledge and ability to summon the Mazo was passed down (from Madara to Tobi), so if the current owner is killed off how would the next person gain access to it?


--Edit--

And for that matter, are we going to allow the Gedo Mazo to hold Bijuu at all to potentially make the ten tails?  Or does that conflict with the Bijuu rule of modifying the current beasts?

[Bocchiere]

I'm pretty sure we are done discussing items, so yeah, I made sure to jump some. We've explained before how it's up to the summons, so no, another summoner can't just tell them not to let them sign. The Mazo should be able to be challenged for because it's the Mazo, it's as strong as a bijuu

[sploofmoof]

I'm pretty sure we are done discussing items, so yeah, I made sure to jump some. We've explained before how it's up to the summons, so no, another summoner can't just tell them not to let them sign. The Mazo should be able to be challenged for because it's the Mazo, it's as strong as a bijuu

But we're deciding on the sense it makes not based on how powerful it is.
The Rinnegan is extremely powerful as well, and we are not discussing challenging for that.

[Bocchiere]

It makes sense to be able to challenge for the Mazo. In the Edo Tensei rules people were telling me that it doesn't matter that it wouldn't make sense to ban implanting eyes, we are making our own rules and they do not have to make sense canon wise. Now in this topic I am being told you should not be able to challenge for the Mazo because it does not make sense canon wise. This is only a perfect example of being really hypocritical. I'm not arguing that it should be challenged for because it is strong, it is because it is a strong item, it is the body of the 10 tails. Also, we should be able to make the 10 tails, as the rule against it was only because we did not know how to do it.

[sploofmoof]

I'm not arguing that it should be challenged for because it is strong, it is because it is a strong item.

I'm confused at what you are trying to say here, could you please elaborate?   It seems you have contradicted yourself, but it is more likely that you just didn't explain it very well.

And as for the Canon-sense, that's not what I'm claiming is the problem with it.  What I'm saying is that in the SL world who else knows how to summon the Mazo?  It is a special/unique type of summon that required special care, a select few abilities required to acquire it, and probably a special way of summoning it.  Even if you outright met the physical requirements to control it, that doesn't mean you would know how to summon it.  That line of logic is persistent in both the Manga AND SL.

[Reimu Hakurei]

Say, here's an idea. How about we challenge for the title of Shinobi Legend? The winner can be an immortal edo tensei that can't be sealed and has all of the bloodlines and items to ever exist.

Y'know, ages ago, back when SL was active and always had at least 60-70 people on at a given time, people didn't care about having the best of the best or hell, even the Sharingan.

In fact, a good number of people did what I like to call, being creative, and created their own bloodlines and balanced out their own jutsus and techniques accordingly. The bijuu weren't claimed, canon items didn't exist on a grand scale like they do now, and everything was just peachy.

And then someone decided having bijuu would be a good idea. And look at how things are now.

I've watched five academy students join and quit SL in the two weeks I've been back, strictly because of the state of the roleplay as it is now. Iwagakure doesn't exist, it's Bocchieregakure because it consists of nothing but Bocchiere and his alts. Constant threats of 'You have this item? I'm gunning for you then' are being made, and rather the fact they are inactive and thus, hoarding said item so taking it away from them with Bijuu-esk rules makes sense or not, it also doesn't.

Can someone show me someone who cares? Someone, that can honestly say that this is a good idea, where hey, you could be roleplaying, but no, you have this item, I'm challenging you for it, too eff-ing bad exists? I don't want to seem aggressive or anything, but this is just excessive. For the past two days that these rules have been placed, I've seen two challenges immediately made by Bocchiere for Mioku's sword, and Shima's Kabutowari, two swords capable of sealing anything and breaking any defense respectively.

And now talk of challenging for the Mazo is showing up.

[Bocchiere]

I'm not arguing that it should be challenged for because it is strong, it is because it is a strong item.

I'm confused at what you are trying to say here, could you please elaborate?   It seems you have contradicted yourself, but it is more likely that you just didn't explain it very well.

And as for the Canon-sense, that's not what I'm claiming is the problem with it.  What I'm saying is that in the SL world who else knows how to summon the Mazo?  It is a special/unique type of summon that required special care, a select few abilities required to acquire it, and probably a special way of summoning it.  Even if you outright met the physical requirements to control it, that doesn't mean you would know how to summon it.  That line of logic is persistent in both the Manga AND SL.

You said we aren't making rules for strong things like Rinnegan, well the Mazo is an item for all I am concerned and it is one of if not the strongest. So it is silly to make sure that such items cannot be hoarded and make the Mazo an exception. All we know about summoning it is that Madara got the Rinnegan and then was like "I summoned it." it isn't explained and it doesn't make sense, I wager it has something to do with the Rinnegan, therefor anyone obtaining a legal 6 Path eye would be capable of summoning the Mazo. Since Mushashi made it so no one can summon it but him with a fuinjutsu one would challenge him for the Mazo and if they won they would get it but would have to rp removing the seal to operate it, if they don't have a 6 Path eye they could still challenge for it but it would just be sitting there, lifeless, if they won.

[Nathan]

So, like Bocc', do you have to have every single canon item? Why can't you make up your own stuff?

[sploofmoof]

I'm not arguing that it should be challenged for because it is strong, it is because it is a strong item.

I'm confused at what you are trying to say here, could you please elaborate?   It seems you have contradicted yourself, but it is more likely that you just didn't explain it very well.

And as for the Canon-sense, that's not what I'm claiming is the problem with it.  What I'm saying is that in the SL world who else knows how to summon the Mazo?  It is a special/unique type of summon that required special care, a select few abilities required to acquire it, and probably a special way of summoning it.  Even if you outright met the physical requirements to control it, that doesn't mean you would know how to summon it.  That line of logic is persistent in both the Manga AND SL.

You said we aren't making rules for strong things like Rinnegan, well the Mazo is an item for all I am concerned and it is one of if not the strongest. So it is silly to make sure that such items cannot be hoarded and make the Mazo an exception. All we know about summoning it is that Madara got the Rinnegan and then was like "I summoned it." it isn't explained and it doesn't make sense, I wager it has something to do with the Rinnegan, therefor anyone obtaining a legal 6 Path eye would be capable of summoning the Mazo. Since Mushashi made it so no one can summon it but him with a fuinjutsu one would challenge him for the Mazo and if they won they would get it but would have to rp removing the seal to operate it, if they don't have a 6 Path eye they could still challenge for it but it would just be sitting there, lifeless, if they won.

If the Mazo is an item, how are any of the summons NOT an item?  Just because of it's canon purpose of holding the 10 tails?  It's still a summon that can be used in other ways without the intent of becoming the 10 tails. 

And yes, the technique for summoning the Gedo Mazo isn't very well known yet, so your solution is to keep the vague explanation of 'Rinnegan+???=Gedo Mazo!' rather than a set of pretty basic rules set up by the current summoner?

Also how are we even sure he's holding onto it to keep it hoarded away?  In my opinion the darn thing shouldn't even EXIST on SL because there's almost no fair way to use it and has the major potential for abuse.  An incomplete Gedo Mazo (missing the 8 and 9 tails) was shown completely decimating cities from miles away with no effort at all, what purpose does that serve other than for Manga related terror plot?  That much one sided power wouldn't stimulate any RP, it would hurt it.

[Camel]

I don't see why not. I think Bocc has already took the initiative and begun taking/requesting challenges for items as we speak...

His own fault.
Nothing within this topic isn't even set in stone yet.
Doesn't surprise me since I take challenges for Shibuki regardless of them belonging to Kirigakure or not and this was even before this was even brought up in the forums.

3. Challenge for the Mazo?  This argument can go either way since there's evidence for both sides.  I personally say no to this though, since the Mazo is classified as a personal summon.  Even if the aggressor manages to steal a contract scroll from the former owner, it doesn't mean that the summoning species will agree to serve.  A pact between a summoner and the summoned is created from a mutual agreement.  This is why Naruto had to prove himself to the Toads and request to be taken under their wing.  He couldn't start out with their full obedience.

I was also pointing out that I happen to agree with Zojin about the Mazo being classified as a personal summon rather then an "item" so I say no challenging for summons...it's too ridiculous at this point.

[Kage]

If someone could, post a full list of suggested rulings regarding them? This way we can sort out better in a list of what to add or remove.

As for canon summons, here's a few things I've gathered up from the discussion.
-One Contract Holder per animal species. A Contract Holder is merely the one who has the ability to summon the contract itself, as well as the defender of the contract.
-Multiple Signers. Signers are able to summon from the animal species they have contracted with.
-One animal species per character. This is to keep a person from being able to summon Toads, Hawks, Snakes, Slugs, etc. As well as to keep one person from holding the contracts of all the canon species.
-One can approach the Contract Holder and ask if they may sign the contract.
-If the Contract Holder refuses, then they may be challenged for the right to sign it. The Contract Holder may also be challenged for the right to hold the contract.
-The Contract Holder must either yield and submit to their defeat, and allow the person to sign it. Or, be knocked out.
-Should the Contract Holder be killed in the challenge, the following will occur.

• The challenger will NOT be able to sign the contract.
• The contract itself will be handed to another signer. (How this is determined is up to the consensus of the other signers.)

Give me your opinions on this guys. Add/edit/remove rules as needed to express your opinions.

[Bocchiere]

From what I saw we have all stopped talking about the item challenges (except Reimu) and have like 80% of the kages agreeing to it, shoot me. Iwagakure has never existed to begin with Reimu, and I leave it open to anyone who wants to go there, which is in fact NOT just my alts, only mostly. You're argument makes it sound like everyone is going to be under threat of death all the time because of this, when that isn't true. I don't here anyone complaining that jinchuriki have to keep fighting all these people and it is really cramping their style.

[Reimu Hakurei]

It's not, Bocc?

I'm just going to leave with the note that you bragged about all the people you were going to kill in MH and let SL continue degrading itself with rules and boundaries that are always manipulated into your favor.